ultimate offering to 3 will be broken with exceed :s

[Saifullah]

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

Good luck Trap Stun and Dust Tornado them if they go first and go off on your turn.

I'm curious to know what sort of player will attack into a backrow and possibly a set monster without a backrow of their own? Most people will not attack unless they have established their own backrow as well. Good luck using Ultimate Offering.

[Final Darkness]

Also remember that we haven't even see the tip of the iceberg for Exceed monsters. Who knows if there will be a Rank 4 Exceed that let's you destroy a card on the field by sending an exceed material attached to it to the graveyard, troll troll troll.

Additional Comment:

Originally Posted by Saifullah

I'm curious to know what sort of player will attack into a backrow and possibly a set monster without a backrow of their own? Most people will not attack unless they have established their own backrow as well. Good luck using Ultimate Offering.

Whether you attack or not, they are going to swarm. What's your point?

[Saifullah]

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

Also remember that we haven't even see the tip of the iceberg for Exceed monsters. Who knows if there will be a Rank 4 Exceed that let's you destroy a card on the field by sending an exceed material attached to it to the graveyard, troll troll troll.

Additional Comment:



Whether you attack or not, they are going to swarm. What's your point?

How are they going to swarm if you put a backrow ready? You don't have to go into battle phase if you don't choose to. You can just end your turn on Main Phase 1, and have a backrow ready to address the problem.

[GuardianEatos]

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

System Down and Cyber Dragon don't do much against Exceed monsters.

I was refering to your point that you can just swarm during the battle phase...If the deck gets to be dominating, maining 3 System Down/Cyber next game kills the strategy.

You swarm, sytem down and you scooop.Simple.And System Down is at 3 meaning a Machine deck can never be dominant in Yugioh.

Also, Trap Stun and Giant Trunade do not work with Ultimate Offering.You swarm but have to deal with Backrow and then you look retarted.

Ultimate Offering is just bad, and if the deck does become good will never reach past tier 2.

[Mark Howard]

Originally Posted by dragonsyth1

ultimate offering + gadgets = full field. 4 rank 4 exceeds and a gadget.

. . . we will barely have this because exceeds come out not long before the next ban list but I have a feeling in japan this will be broken for quite a while.

Exceeds in general are too good. Synchro Summoning without Tuners... >_________>

[Saifullah]

Exceeds will change the game much too drastically. There has to be more restrictions on it. Perhaps only 1 Exceed Summon per turn?

[Lord of the Nerds]

Originally Posted by CapitalG

the first synchros sucked too, do you really think they'd make them the backbone of an entire series if they didnt plan on making some broke as **** ones ?

look at synchros... started with Junk Warrior, but eventually we got DSF, Brionac, Trishula etc

They ALSO started with Colossal and Dust. So you fail at YGO history forever.

Originally Posted by tonman

Actually gadgets for easy exceeds seems pretty powerful. One turn, 1 gadget and 1 UO= 3 Exceed beaters?

Theory-OOOOOOOOOH!

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

That's why you do the combo during opponent's turn. Then on your turn, play Trunade/Trap Stun before doing Exceed summon. In decks like Gadget where monster just replaces themselves upon summon, UO is a pretty good swarm engine.

Additional Comment:



So you somehow has the knowledge of all the Exceed monsters that are to be released in the upcoming sets? How?

Um, that combo sucks ballsack. Gadgets are about advantage, and that mitigates advantage. You'd be better off with Spies and some ****ty Dupe combo.

And, no. If they're good enough to be good with that, their busted anywhere else. **** combo will always be ****.

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

Read Ultimate Offering again, you can do it on your opponent's turn.

You normal summon a Gadget, get another. Set UO. Use UO to normal summon 4 more Gadgets on your opponent's turn. Your turn, play Trunade/Stun, Exceed summon 2 Rank 4 monsters. Play another Gadget, Exceed another Rank 4. Look! 3 Exceed monsters with no loss of advantage! Not that hard to figure out:/
And you only lose 2000 lifepoints, the cost of Solemn Warning.

Their BATTLE PHASE! Read the mother-******* card. They'll just beat over them. Good lord, you're special.

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

Ultimate Offering + Gadget provides the same card advantage as Samurai + double Gateway. It's just that Gadget did not have a good enough reason to swarm, now they do.

No, and no. They don't have reason to swarm with **** when they'd be better off with simplification and advantage, and Gateway loops and turns Synchros into +0s, not the -1s they are in this, doesn't cost LP, and gets better ****. NO.

Originally Posted by Final Darkness

Good luck Trap Stun and Dust Tornado them if they go first and go off on your turn.

Except then I can react much more easily. You fail yugimanz forever.

Originally Posted by Zyuma

Oh god please i don't want 3 of these http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/No._39_...g_Emperor_Hope on the field in 1 turn.

Why? It sucks ballsack.

[Red Comet]

Originally Posted by Saifullah

Exceeds will change the game much too drastically. There has to be more restrictions on it. Perhaps only 1 Exceed Summon per turn?

The restrictions are that they don't have a level and their effects are tied to their material monsters and you need exactly two monsters of the same level.

They have at best two time use effects can't be used for synchros or rituals and most of them are worthless once they lose their OL units.


and seriously you people are worried about Ultimate offering?

(bad)Gadgets will try this say screw it and just go back to what they normally do control and slow swarm.

[DunnoBro]

Originally Posted by Lord of the Nerds

Really, l2p. Ultimate Offering will NEVER be good.

My god, did you actually think about this for even a second? Or are you just ignorant?

First of all, this is only a two card combo. But even that is misleading, as there are nine(at least in op's scenario) of the other card needed. So it's really like a 1.2 card combo. And only 1.5 if splashed into current gadgets decks.

Also, in decks which run gadgets they generally run lots of other monsters too... so Ultimate Offering will almost never be dead. Especially with gearframe.

With Overload Fusion at two, this also means if they DO somehow stop the play, you can use all those machines you just summoned for something big as hell if you got cyber. Especially if they ever make a R4 Exceed which is a machine.

Assuming you saved the last gadget you can:

Avarice them back to do this all over again + 2 cards
Scrap Recycle them back to do it again + 2 cards(which with UO is easy)

This combo also really thins out your deck, so drawing these cards would be easy.

A build dependant on this combo could also rely on even more deck thinning. Most likely the Upstart Goblin + hope for an escape engine to take advantage of the cost for UO. Making drawing what you need EXTREMELY ******* EASY.

All these combos were thought up within seconds of reading this thread. I'm sure there's many more, but as you can see punishing overextension here is not an end-all at all for them.

Also, three of hope means you can negate up to six attacks whenever you want. That's pretty powerful and contributes to the control gadgets love to do so much.

And also, UO can be used at the end of the opponents battle phase. Meaning they can't attack them and you can summon as many as you want.

[CapitalG]

Originally Posted by Lord of the Nerds

They ALSO started with Colossal and Dust. So you fail at YGO history forever.

yes I'm well aware of that, you forgot Goyo btw. the point was about half the initial synchros were trash, hell over half of them are trash still. But 4-5 good ones are enough to mold an entire format. Why people think this wont happen with exceed is beyond me.

And if I had to guess considering level 4 is the most commonly played monsters in YGO. I'd say Rank 4 Exceeds are going to be the equivalent of level 8 synchros in terms of design.

[animesaint]

mind crush at 3?

[DunnoBro]

Originally Posted by CapitalG

yes I'm well aware of that, you forgot Goyo btw. the point was about half the initial synchros were trash, hell over half of them are trash still. But 4-5 good ones are enough to mold an entire format. Why people think this wont happen with exceed is beyond me.

And if I had to guess considering level 4 is the most commonly played monsters in YGO. I'd say Rank 4 Exceeds are going to be the equivalent of level 8 synchros in terms of design.

Colossal, dust, and goyo are/were not nearly as good as brio, dsf, and trishula though. Yeah, goyo is banned like DSF but it wasn't good enough to single-handedly break several already good decks. I really think it's very grasping for someone to compare them to their later counterparts... They are good, no doubt. But not as splashable, or devastating as the later ones were.

Also, i feel like lv.4 exceeds will generally be trash. As lv.8 synchros were generally good because they weren't too easy to summon with lv.4s. As most lv.4 tuners were trash. Whereas Rank 4 exceeds will be far easier and therefore shouldn't be as good as lv.8. synchros.

Also Mind Crush wouldn't hurt them too much as gadgets are really easy to draw into. ESPECIALLY with Ally Birdman coming out which will almost definitely be used in this build as it's a -500 special summoned lv.3 machine tuner with access to powerful machine synchros.

[Lord of the Nerds]

Originally Posted by Isaac52

My god, did you actually think about this for even a second? Or are you just ignorant?

First of all, this is only a two card combo. But even that is misleading, as there are nine(at least in op's scenario) of the other card needed. So it's really like a 1.2 card combo. And only 1.5 if splashed into current gadgets decks.

Also, in decks which run gadgets they generally run lots of other monsters too... so Ultimate Offering will almost never be dead. Especially with gearframe.

With Overload Fusion at two, this also means if they DO somehow stop the play, you can use all those machines you just summoned for something big as hell if you got cyber. Especially if they ever make a R4 Exceed which is a machine.

Assuming you saved the last gadget you can:

Avarice them back to do this all over again + 2 cards
Scrap Recycle them back to do it again + 2 cards(which with UO is easy)

This combo also really thins out your deck, so drawing these cards would be easy.

A build dependant on this combo could also rely on even more deck thinning. Most likely the Upstart Goblin + hope for an escape engine to take advantage of the cost for UO. Making drawing what you need EXTREMELY ******* EASY.

All these combos were thought up within seconds of reading this thread. I'm sure there's many more, but as you can see punishing overextension here is not an end-all at all for them.

Also, three of hope means you can negate up to six attacks whenever you want. That's pretty powerful and contributes to the control gadgets love to do so much.

And also, UO can be used at the end of the opponents battle phase. Meaning they can't attack them and you can summon as many as you want.

They all suck. UO sucks, inherently. They had an OTK similar to this, and it sucked, too. People hyped it, too, IIRC. Gadgets were, are, and will always be about advantage. This is not the way to go. You drop 4 Exceeds and a Chimeratech, or whatever? Okay, Roar/Waboku/etc. to LV/other destruction. Okay, congrats, you burned through everything you had to cost me three cards. I hope you have three pot of avarices, so you can cost me another three. Also, after your hopes are empty, I can kill your deck with Asura Priest. All of your combos are based on UO, which loses to everything, and a lack of defense/response on my part. Therefor, they FAIL. L2P, please.

Originally Posted by CapitalG

yes I'm well aware of that, you forgot Goyo btw. the point was about half the initial synchros were trash, hell over half of them are trash still. But 4-5 good ones are enough to mold an entire format. Why people think this wont happen with exceed is beyond me.

And if I had to guess considering level 4 is the most commonly played monsters in YGO. I'd say Rank 4 Exceeds are going to be the equivalent of level 8 synchros in terms of design.

So I did. O agree, they probably will bust a format of five, but my point is that this is most certainly NOT the way they'll do it. This way sucks.

[Red Comet]

Originally Posted by Isaac52

Also, i feel like lv.4 exceeds will generally be trash. As lv.8 synchros were generally good because they weren't too easy to summon with lv.4s. As most lv.4 tuners were trash. Whereas Rank 4 exceeds will be far easier and therefore shouldn't be as good as lv.8. synchros.

.

Rank 4 as far as we know based on the one we have so far is Equivalent in attack and defense and effect to a Level 6-7

[CapitalG]

how is a Gadget + UO burning through everything I have ? thats 2 cards...... I'm assuming some of these will have stardust/thought ruler/Colossal Fighter type built in protection.

Additional Comment:

Originally Posted by Red Comet

Rank 4 as far as we know based on the one we have so far is Equivalent in attack and defense and effect to a Level 6-7

so basically with 3-4 you could otk, flip Ultimate Offering, summon gadget. win.

[Spade.]

Rofl, this is terrible. You're assuming your opponent has NO counters to your gadget summon. Stun and Trunade aren't even in the equation because you can't use those without stopping offering.

[Lord of the Nerds]

Originally Posted by CapitalG

how is a Gadget + UO burning through everything I have ? thats 2 cards...... I'm assuming some of these will have stardust/thought ruler/Colossal Fighter type built in protection.

Additional Comment:



so basically with 3-4 you could otk, flip Ultimate Offering, summon gadget. win.

You go through 6 gadgets, 2500 LP, and 3 dudes in your extra deck, and you make me lose 3 cards. You can't continue until you get a PoA. I then laugh at you, and RO your attempt at Chimeratech, which ***** up your deck, good.

[GuardianEatos]

Originally Posted by Spade.

Rofl, this is terrible. You're assuming your opponent has NO counters to your gadget summon. Stun and Trunade aren't even in the equation because you can't use those without stopping offering.

This.

Flip Ultimate Offering,summon,summon,summon,summon..exceed..solemn...exc eed..solemn..scoop.

Ultimate Offering has to deal with Backrow, Konami is a genius after all.

[CapitalG]

If I summon 3-4 exceeds in one turn , I'm going to win that turn......I didnt bother reading your whole post because from about the first half of it, you clearly dont understand that.

[Spade.]

Originally Posted by CapitalG

If I summon 3-4 exceeds in one turn , I'm going to win that turn......I didnt bother reading your whole post because from about the first half of it, you clearly dont understand that.

How are you getting this off exactly? Tools? My Body?

[CapitalG]

Originally Posted by Spade.

Rofl, this is terrible. You're assuming your opponent has NO counters to your gadget summon. Stun and Trunade aren't even in the equation because you can't use those without stopping offering.

You dont seem to realize this could become like "Random Stein", a regular Gadget deck can simply win with through its basic win conditions. Or during that one turn where you have one card set not wanting to overextend, they mst, flip over UO GG.

much like Cheater Chengs YCS deck, its a basic machina with 2-3 otks in it that can work at anytime.

Additional Comment:

Originally Posted by Spade.

How are you getting this off exactly? Tools? My Body?

Mst, seven tools, dust , solemn ?

[Final Darkness]

So much fail in one post

Originally Posted by Lord of the Nerds

Um, that combo sucks ballsack. Gadgets are about advantage, and that mitigates advantage.And, no. If they're good enough to be good with that, their busted anywhere else. **** combo will always be ****.[/color][/font]

Gadget didn't have Exceed to play with before. Two card full field combo. Yeah **** combo is ****

Originally Posted by Lord of the Nerds

Their BATTLE PHASE! Read the mother-******* card. They'll just beat over them. Good lord, you're special.

They beat over them, you summon another one. Are you that slow?

Originally Posted by Lord of the Nerds

[No, and no. They don't have reason to swarm with **** when they'd be better off with simplification and advantage, and Gateway loops and turns Synchros into +0s, not the -1s they are in this, doesn't cost LP, and gets better ****. NO.

Except then I can react much more easily. You fail yugimanz forever.

Yes and yes. They have a reason to swarm now. Get with the times. By your logic, **** card is **** regardless new cards being introduced, like Rescue Cat, Mind Control, Necro Gardna, and BftDD, right?

[Spade.]

Originally Posted by CapitalG

You dont seem to realize this could become like "Random Stein", a regular Gadget deck can simply beat with through its basic win conditions. Or during that one turn where you have one card set not wanting to overextend, they mst, flip over UO GG.

much like Cheater Chengs YCS deck, its a basic machina with 2-3 otks in it that can work at anytime.

Additional Comment:



Mst, seven tools, dust , solemn ?

Then you'd be assuming your opponent doesn't have counters to those. Seriously, this combo is jank and relies on your opponent having no defense. There are ENDLESS amounts of combos that come off as broke when the opponent has a blank field / Me have endless counters to their counters.

[Final Darkness]

Arguments about counter don't work, :/. Gateway combos can be stopped by about 20 cards in a typical deck too.

[GuardianEatos]

Well, the reason why Pot of Duality sucks is that it seems like mine always gets negated by Dark Bribe.It has such a reputation that it's play instantly demands negation.