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Old 02-13-2011, 11:20 AM   #1
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Default Karakuris

Most Karakuris have the phrase:

Quote:
This card must attack if able.
Does this mean that if I have a face-up attack position Karakuri monster that can change its battle position, I cannot change it to defense position (thus making it unable to attack)?

If a Karakuri monster is equipped with something like "Twin Swords of Flashing Light - Tryce", I must attack twice with it, correct?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karakuri Komachi mdl 224 “Ninishi”
This card must attack if able. When this face-up card on the field is selected as an attack target, change its battle position. While this card is face-up on the field, you can Normal Summon a "Karakuri" monster in addition to your Normal Summon or Set during each of your turns.
Does Komachi work like "Swap Frog" in that multiples of it will not allow multiple summons? Or will three Komachis allow three extra summons?

Can something like "Machina Fortress" be summoned when affected by "Alchemy Cycle"? If so, what are some similar cards that can reduce (a large) amount of attack?

If cards such as "Confusion Chaff" and "Equip Shot" did not have their effect prevention line, would Karakuris still change battle position? That is, when battle is simulateded by these card effects, is it considered that one of my monsters selected another as an attack target, or is battle simply waged between them? If it does select targets, will something like "Karakuri Klock" work (granted that the effect negation line is, once again, omitted)?
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:28 AM   #2
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1. they attack if able. that is it. if it is defense, it cannot attack. nothing changes. you can do whatever you could normally do in the game.

2. you only have to attack once.

3. extra normal summons do not stack.

4. ..........

5. i'll let someone else answer because i have to look up some of those effects and my netbook is slow like that.
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Last edited by illusionX : 02-13-2011 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:29 AM   #3
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1) You can change its position. What the effect is telling you is that if you meet all the conditions for the Karakuri Monster to attack (i.e, it's in Attack Position, you can enter your Battle Phase, and there are no effects preventing attacks like Spellbinding Circle), then you must enter your Battle Phase before ending your turn and you must attack with that monster.

If you equip it Tryce, after your first attack you still meet every requirement for the Karakuri Monster to attack, so you must attack again.

2) Preliminary rulings say you can only gain its effect once per turn.

3) I...don't get it.

4) If I remember correctly, these Cards force the battle into Damage Calculation immediatly, so I doubt it would count as selecting the monster as an Attack Target.
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:37 AM   #4
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@3
Are you confusing Alchemy Cycle with something else? Cycle only effects your own cards that are currently on the field with the card resolves. You can summon Fortress, then flip your own cycle on it.
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:38 AM   #5
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If the karakuri met its requirment to attack, i don't see why it needs to attack again if you don't want to.
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:42 AM   #6
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3. Oh, heh heh, I forgot to say "Machine Duplication"...
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Originally Posted by Piratechnik
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:54 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illusionX View Post
If the karakuri met its requirment to attack, i don't see why it needs to attack again if you don't want to.
After attacking, it's able to attack once again, and its text tells us that if it can attack, it must attack.

It basically takes away your ability to just say no.

Quote:
3. Oh, heh heh, I forgot to say "Machine Duplication"...
You can Special Summon more copies of Fortress from the Deck. It has no restrictions on how to be Summoned.

There aren't many Cards that drain that much ATK, but that's probably better asked in Strategies or Single Card Discussion.
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Old 02-13-2011, 11:58 AM   #8
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But it did attack, so it's requirement to attack has been met.
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:00 PM   #9
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On Komachi: it's been confirmed in rulings that whether you have one or three Komachi's in play, you still only get the one additional Normal Summon.

As for Alchemy Cycle'd Fortress being Machine Duplicated: yes, it's valid. Machine Duplication does not "look at" the attack values of the monsters coming out of the deck, if that makes sense.
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:03 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illusionX View Post
But it did attack, so it's requirement to attack has been met.
Its effect doesn't tell it to "attack once", it only forces it to attack if able.

For example, consider that a player has two Battle Phases due to An Unfortunate Report. You enter your first Battle Phase, and since your Karakuri Monster is able to attack, you must attack. You enter your second Battle Phase. Your Karakuri Monster can attack again, and its effect tells you that if it can attack, it must attack. So you have to attack again.

I can't really find rulings under neither forced-attack Cards nor double-attack Cards, but testing with our old friend Berserk Gorilla + Twin Flashing Swords - Tryce tells us that you must attack twice with Gorilla.

It's a different way to interpretating an order. If you are told "if you see a target, shoot it", your interpretation would be to shoot only one target and go home, while the order probably implies to stay on guard for any number of targets and shoot them all.

Quote:
On Komachi: it's been confirmed in rulings that whether you have one or three Komachi's in play, you still only get the one additional Normal Summon.
The Wiki rulings are still preliminary.

Even if it's the likeliest result, they don't really mean anything at this point.
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:19 PM   #11
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I agree. just pointing out the obvious argument before someone else did
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:47 PM   #12
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So, having multiple Komachis at once won't stack... Ok...

What if I have a Komachi in MF1 and a different one in MF2? Still no?
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:49 PM   #13
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Much like multiple Swap Frogs, if the ruling is correct, you would only gain the effect once per turn, regardless of how separate the time frames are.
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:51 PM   #14
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Alrighty, thanks a lot guise...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Piratechnik
"Calling all Duelists! Brace yourselves as a new rarity hits the Yu-Gi-Oh! trading card game! Above Ultimate Rare and Ghost Rare, the new 'Photon Rare' has such a magnificent shine your retinal cells will implode upon seeing it!"
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