The Official Spellcaster Discussion Thread VIII

Joenen · 10-12-2009, 03:36 PM

Alright, welcome to thread number 8 of spellcaster disccussion.

Since we have so many "Official" threads already, here's one for spellcasters. This thread follows the same rules as the other official threads, except spellcasters are obviously the main topic. Please refrain from excessive flaming, no flaming is preferred. Any stratagies or concepts regarding casters, look/post here. Spellcasters are arguably within the reach of high tier status, so let's come up with good stratagies for casters to help get them there!

Spellcaster deck themes

Counter Caster Decks
Focuses on abusing Magic Citadel and Spell counter Effects. Divides into
Counter stall/burndown
Counter Burn (stall/burn)
Counter Caster (beatdown)
TeleCaster (meta)

Village Beatdown Decks
Focuses on locking the opp with Secret Village of the Spellcasters, plus other lock combos.
Honest Vailo Village
Vailo Village
Honest Magicians
Village Drain Dodge deck
Standard Beatdown

Spellcaster Assault
Dark Magician
Fortune Lady
Gemini Casters
ritual casters
Gravekeepers
Lightsworn

Counter Caster Decks

Counter Stall/Burndown
Coundter (s/b/d) Focuses on both an offensive and defensive stall/burndown (stall and burn mixed with beatdown) by using stall spells, then use Disenchanter to unlock youself during your turn allowing you to attack, then relocking your opponent, and gaining spellcounter's on citadel etc in the process. This stratagy typically finishes off with Tempest Magician, but also puts pressure on the opp throughout the duel, so the opp cannot atk, and only defend, while you set up for a massive burn at the end.
Subdivided into
Counter Stall/Burn
Counter (s/b) Stall's with continuous/face up spellcards, backed up by disenchanter for recycling, finishing with tempest and citadel. Focuses more on defense than its balanced offense and defense "counter" part above.
Counter Beat Down
Without stall power and much more offensive, May finish with tempest, but is flexably situational with either a tempest finisher or Arcanite pummeling. No burn support other than tempest.
TeleCasters, by SpellCountersIsMana
The caster version of TeleDAD, without the D-Heros and occasionally without the DAD, It consist of multiple engines such as; Apprentice, Gravekeeper's Spy, Dark Creator, and Mana (Spellcounters). The Deck can work like synchro cat looking for the OTK with Spys and Junk Synchron , syncing into Arcanite and Tempest for Game, however there is 2 more plans/engines that follow. The 2nd is the Magical Exemplar counter comeback, which sub divides into SSing from your grave and/or torrientialing so SS Endymion. The Last engine is the Dark Creator, he maybe the last card in hand until you SS him and bring back that Thought Ruler, C-Fighter, w/e big hit dark monster you thought you lost. Or better you wait for a monster then bring a tuner back, and stack for plaugespreader. All in all 1 will work if not all 3. Only Down fall of this deck is overextending, a bad side deck, and the occasional bad synchro monsters. This deck can be a budget build except for 2 cards Plague and E-Teleport which is 25ish together. Or you can holo out your deck and add DAD to make it seem like you worked your ass off for it (trying to). If you plan to build this deck, make sure you know how the meta game works, and looks for their weaknesses, then exploit it. ~S.C.I.M

Village beatdown decks
Divides into
Honest Vailo Village
Has a Focus on Maha Vailo's effect and Mage Power plus other equip cards. Also fixed with Light support and Spellcasters like copycat and Honest. May be divided into
Vailo Village (without Honest)
Honest Spellcasters (Without Vailo)
These deck's may be run without village, but village is more powerful in these builds and is effective more so than citadel here. They both have the ability to lock combo as well. Upon further experimentation, shining angel, honest, Jowgen the spiritualist, Copy Cat, find their calling here. The idea is to run low level/atk light spellcasters that exemplar can easily summon, to beat face and control the game, maintaining control with Jowgen/honest, among other cards like valkyria and defender the mage knight. ANti Meta at its best as far as spellcasters are concerned.
Standard Village Beatdown
No direction other than beatdown. counter Caster's are not as effective, but monsters Like Kycoo and summoner monk thrive here much more so thant their "counter" parts for example. The deck still needs support from the Ocg, but once the US and Euro get Ice Queen, Geomancer of the Ice boundary, and medium of the ice boundary, the deck will be considerably more powerful. Also lock's to support the beatdown.
Village Drain Dodge deck
A type of secret village beatdown/control deck that plays off of the strength of the current meta skill drain. Though the Light and Dark Imprisoning mirrors may replace skill drain, the idea is to rely on other methods of controlling your opponent, such as secret village, bottomless trap hole, solemn judgement, dark bribe, etc. It is possible to blend various beatdown stratagies, particularly the Light Beatdown style with honests and the like. Thank SCthe Only (Shodaime-san) for contributions to the deck discussion for this. Here's a link detailing the proper usage and rulings of skill drain like cards. Probably the best spellcaster deck available at the current meta.
http://www.pojo.biz/board/showpost.p...02&postcount=9

Spellcaster/Assault Mode
Focuses on getting out Arcanite Assault and other AM's (Stardust Assault) with Buster Support (arcane Apprentice etc). Utilizes counter support as well as other meta cards.

Dark Magician
A beatdown which largely focuses on abusing the Dark Magician for it's name and its being a normal monster. Combos of cards used includes birhtright, Anciant Rules, Ehero Prisma especially, and other DM specific Support. Dark Palidin is finally playable somewhat in this deck, as well as Dark Eradicator Warlock, and Knight's Title etc. Some potential, but not the strongest of spellcaster Builds, and may use secret village.

Most notable spellcaster cards (most helpful to the theme itself)
Breaker the Magical Warrior
Defender, the magical knight
Magical Exemplar
Injection Fairy Lily
Apprentice Magician
Old vindictive Magician
Crystal Seer
Phoedelyzer
Chaos Sorcerer
Ice Queen (OCG)
Medium of the Ice Boudary (ocg)
Copycat
Maha Vailo
Magical Marrionette
Dark Red Enchanter
Chaos Command Magician
Crusader of Endymion (OCG gemini)
Skilled Dark Magician
Dark Magician
Relinquished
Beautiful Goddess of Salvation, Norswenko
Witch of Catoblepass and Fate
The Tricky
Jowgen the Spiritualist
summoner monk
TUNERS
Night's End Sorcerer
Frequency Magician
Tuned MAgician (OCG gemini)
Arcane Apprentice
Geomancer of the Ice Boundary (ocg)
SYNCHROS
Arcanite Magician
Tempest Magician
Explosive Magician

Spells (most helpful to the theme)
Secret village of the Spellcasters
Magical Citadel of Endymion
Magical Dimension
Spell Power Grasp

Traps
Magician's Circle
Anti spell
Miracle Restoring

Spells that help our theme indirectly

Book of Moon and Shrink
Burden of the mighty and Solidarity
Supervis + other gemini support
Preparation for the Ritual + other ritual support

Other Traps that help spellcasters indirectly
Royal Decree
Limit Reverse
Gracefull revival
Limit Reverse

Anime Only Suuport Cards that Would significantly help our decks. Beg konami for their creation!
Dark Renewal
Tech Genus Cyber Magician
Tech Genus Wonder Magician
Dark Tuner Black Goddess of Witaka

Other Themes that help indirectly
Gravekeepers
Lightsworns
Fortune Ladies
http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=693086
http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=728940
Gemini
Ritual

GK decks are uncompetitive and have no strataggy worth manipulating, howevver, they have gone undiscussed and thus there is nothing yet to say about them.

LS decks deserve there own thread entirely, however, there is support in usefull spellcasters that one could use in a light village beatdown deck. Not needed to be discussed here, but worth some mention in deck builds.

Fortune Ladies
A new deck with tons of potential, Fortune Ladies may just be one of the best one shot series to date. Six monsters intotal with different elements and levels each, ranging from 1-6. There names are their attributes with "y' at the end. All are spellcasters. If you want to better understand their effects, you should check out wikia or shrieks site. The idea is to search with Lighty, Swarm with recursion and beat with Darky, Big Beat with Earthy, Monster manage and burn with Firery, Insane Draw with Watery, S/t control with windy. They have various spell and trap support however, you are mostly better off with the current meta usage of spells. Best used with Future vision or Secret village field spell, and combine with exemplar and lv 2 NeS to cover all bases. Lighty must be removed by a card effect to search, so DDGate, Compulsory evac, and Interdimensional matter transporter and fortune slip help (along with future vision). The cards are yet to be released, so we can only wait and see how well they can do. they show much promise however. In SOVR we are also given Witch of Catoblepass and fate, allowing one to control the special summoning of your opponent, while future vision works to stop their normal summon. combined, you prevent the opp from sommoning as long as you have fortune ladies in the grave to fuel Witch of fate's effect. This card makes FLs able to compete with glads, ls, black wing, etc. The future looks bright as we might see the first competitive spellcaster theme.

Gemini Magicians
Best used with a citadel build, but can be used with village. The addition of Crusader of Endymion and Tuned Magician make this deck possible (as before, there weren't enough gemini spellcasters to make this deck). Uses Supervis to activate effects, citadel combos well with crusader and arcanite, as well as with Dark Valkyria. DV is not a spellcaster, but the counter gaining effecct plus the monster destruction make her more useful than magical marrionette since getting her second summoned efect is much easier now. Gemini Summoner is good in that he provides field prescence and allows you to get you geminis to the field easier. Combined with defender, the mage Knight, he should last a while. Finishes with either tempest or arcanite the best and utilizes some other normal support if desired.

Ritual variants
With the addition of Norsewenko, and the two ritual fiends that will be released in Stardust overdrive, rituals may finally become a playable deck. For spellcasters, we have access to not only norswenko,but the ledgendary flame lord, and relinquished. The latter being the most formidable ritual, next to norswenko. With only one star required, one can easily summon relinquished over and over with magical exemplar, after it has been properly summoned of course. ritual foregonehelps accomplish this combo as well, along with preparations for the ritual spell card. Ritual spellcasters are definately a deck type to watch as the potential to be competitive has finally presented itself for this decktype.

(more to be added as thread progresses)
I can't pretend that I can dedicate myself to continuously update this thread every day, but I'll try to atleast once a week but I'll update as frequently as I can.

So let's talk about Casters! Any problems with the theme, things they need/don't need, cards to run and cards to avoid, and cards that work for some builds, but not for others (village vs endymion for example).

RULINGS!
here are very important rulings to know about some key spellcaster cards.

SPELL COUNTERS: Spellcasters that gain counters when a spell is activated is a continuous effect. Your opp cannot chain to it since it is an effect applied at the resolution of a spellcard. Spellcasters/and cards with an effect like this, citadel, tower of babel etc, cannot Activate that effect it is simply applied and therefore your opp cannot chain divine wrath to that type of gaining effect.

Cards like breaker and arcanite are different. Their effects activate when they are summoned, they are not continuous, and can be chained to. This includes Defender and Tempests first effects as well.

Also, Defender the mage knight also has a continuous effect, whenever a spellcaster would be destroyed, effect. This is applied not activated and cannot be chained to.

MAGCIAL DIMENSION
Does not target. No part of its effect does. Tributing is not a cost for activation, just part of its effect. Your opponent cannot chain to the summon of your monster if you chose to destroy a monster with magical dimension. Otherwise, they can respond to the monsters summon. However, Magical dimension cannot be negated or destroyed by cards like Stardust dragon, my body as a shield, destruction jammer, because its destruction effect is optional. The listed cards cannot negate cards that May or May not destroy a monster, like magical di\mension. Magical dimension is a very tricky card, don't let your opp activate anything inbetween its effect, because quite frankly, they can't, its illegal. You can't interupt a cards effect when it hasn't resolved yet.

Also magical dimension will cause you to miss the timing if you summon a monster like DMoC or breaker, should you chose to destroy a monster. This is because the last thing to happan would be a monsters destruction, not a monsters' summon, so effects that would happan upon summoning would not activate if you chose to also destroy a monster.

Secret Village:

Will not be destroyed if your opponent sets a field spell. Only one active field spell can be on the field, but there can be one active and one set field spell between two players. Secret village would only be destroyed if you want to set a field spell. Since it occupies your field spell zone, your opponent however, cannot remove your card by setting one in their zone. Same is true for citadel, but the activation of a field spell would destroy citadel by card mechanic not effect. Citadel is vulnerable where village is not.

More rulings will come as needed..

Next Thread
http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread...606333--thread 9

Previous Thread
http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=759394 ---thread 7

duel_master 002 · 10-12-2009, 03:45 PM

Subscribing and 1st post =o

13eyond13irthday · 10-12-2009, 03:55 PM

Why didnt you include Summoner Monk to the list of most notable spellcasters? I just added him and Rescue cat + 3 X Saber Airbellums and I can usually summon 2 Arcanites by my fourth turn, except the last 3 duels I was in for some reason couldnt draw him at all

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 13eyond13irthday

Why didnt you include Summoner Monk to the list of most notable spellcasters? I just added him and Rescue cat + 3 X Saber Airbellums and I can usually summon 2 Arcanites by my fourth turn, except the last 3 duels I was in for some reason couldnt draw him at all

last 4 cough. XD

Ghaleonh41 · 10-12-2009, 04:20 PM

Such a popular topic we have... I'm thinking about judging a Regional this Saturday...

Joenen · 10-12-2009, 04:22 PM

lol ^

Wow, I can't believe I forgot summoner monk! Fail...I'll fix that.

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 04:22 PM

do any of yall have yvd also?

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 13eyond13irthday

Why didnt you include Summoner Monk to the list of most notable spellcasters? I just added him and Rescue cat + 3 X Saber Airbellums and I can usually summon 2 Arcanites by my fourth turn, except the last 3 duels I was in for some reason couldnt draw him at all

We can't get every Spellcaster on the list lol.
I think everyone knows Him by now,without being mention.

Joenen · 10-12-2009, 04:24 PM

fixed. If you see any other issues, please let me know everyone! Remembber that I'm always looking to improve the first post! Though I'm tired right now, so maybe later...

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaCandymanXD

do any of yall have yvd also?

All of does in some way lol

Joenen · 10-12-2009, 04:25 PM

I do yvd haves...I just don't have time during the week... friday-sunday i might give it a try.

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 04:29 PM

mmk cool. i would like to play yo deck.

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 04:32 PM

Can't wait for Overdrive,only about 3 weeks+ away.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghaleonh41

Such a popular topic we have... I'm thinking about judging a Regional this Saturday...

You judge at events.

I never ask before but what does Judges get for doing Events.

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rezman55

Can't wait for Overdrive,only about 3 weeks+ away.

You judge at events.

I never ask before but what does Judges get for doing Events.

whats in overdrive?

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaCandymanXD

whats in overdrive?

Alot of Spellcaster stuff,of course.Fortune Ladies,Norsewemko,Ritual Support,Spellcaster both Gemini and regular.

Of course I also banking for one of the Light sworn to be a spellcaster,Although it's kinda a Double Sword if it's too Good in LS since I probably have to go against it as well.

SCtheOnly · 10-12-2009, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaCandymanXD

whats in overdrive?

Norswenko, Beautiful Goddess of Salvation and the ritual fiend monsters.

Additional Comment:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rezman55

Can't wait for Overdrive,only about 3 weeks+ away.

You judge at events.

I never ask before but what does Judges get for doing Events.

Depends on the TO staff. Usually the standard is around 24-36 packs of the most recent set. I'm not sure how it's done during previews. I'm doing the one at my locals. Looking forward to overdrive myself.^^

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 04:52 PM

I need to go get some Shiny Relinquished,so I can build a Ritual Deck around it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCtheOnly

Norswenko, Beautiful Goddess of Salvation and the ritual fiend monsters.

Additional Comment:

Depends on the TO staff. Usually the standard is around 24-36 packs of the most recent set. I'm not sure how it's done during previews. I'm doing the one at my locals. Looking forward to overdrive myself.^^

Oh,I figure it would be around that area of stuff.Thanks for the info ^_^

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rezman55

I need to go get some Shiny Relinquished,so I can build a Ritual Deck around it.

Oh,I figure it would be around that area of stuff.Thanks for the info ^_^

i'm already working on mine/

Lupo · 10-12-2009, 05:17 PM

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lupo

Looks pretty Solid.

Joenen · 10-12-2009, 05:40 PM

SD17-JP004 Dual Soldier
WIND/Warrior - Dual/2/500/300
This card is treated as a Normal Monster while face-up on the field or in the Graveyard. While this card is face-up on the field, you can Normal Summon it again to have it be treated as an Effect Monster with this effect. ● This card cannot be destroyed by battle once per turn. If this card battles, you can Special Summon 1 Level 4 or lower Dual Monster other than "Dual Soldier" from your Deck after damage calculation

might not be as ready to go as apprentice, its just that apprentice and phoedelyzer really clog the deck imo. I'd use this instead, in combo with something else. I'd also beware as far as supervis goes. I would NOT run it with three copies of magic sieze/spellpwergrasp.

Spell wise, I'd go with two endymion city two supervis, one terraforming, one arms hole, and some other method of returning equip spells from the grave to the hand. Cause you set yourself up with dead draw potential if you over do it,, also, I'd consider gemini spark, and other cards from sovr, I'd check spoilers for that pack, sovr to get a good idea of what support you need.

Lupo · 10-12-2009, 05:47 PM

Gemini Spark, possibly with Allure for draw power?

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joenen

SD17-JP004 Dual Soldier
WIND/Warrior - Dual/2/500/300
This card is treated as a Normal Monster while face-up on the field or in the Graveyard. While this card is face-up on the field, you can Normal Summon it again to have it be treated as an Effect Monster with this effect. ● This card cannot be destroyed by battle once per turn. If this card battles, you can Special Summon 1 Level 4 or lower Dual Monster other than "Dual Soldier" from your Deck after damage calculation

might not be as ready to go as apprentice, its just that apprentice and phoedelyzer really clog the deck imo. I'd use this instead, in combo with something else. I'd also beware as far as supervis goes. I would NOT run it with three copies of magic sieze/spellpwergrasp.

Spell wise, I'd go with two endymion city two supervis, one terraforming, one arms hole, and some other method of returning equip spells from the grave to the hand. Cause you set yourself up with dead draw potential if you over do it,, also, I'd consider gemini spark, and other cards from sovr, I'd check spoilers for that pack, sovr to get a good idea of what support you need.

It's not bad at all,but in some way I feel this guy should have not been a Gemini.

Of course it probably for the best that he's a Gemini.

ThaCandymanXD · 10-12-2009, 05:50 PM

Joenen!
Link to SCtheOnly's deck thingy is not found.

Rezman55 · 10-12-2009, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lupo

Gemini Spark, possibly with Allure for draw power?

I probably have to think about it but it does have it uses especially with Supervis.
Quick play a nice plus.