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Old 02-07-2012, 03:37 PM   #1
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Exclamation Pot of Duality: Another Look at the No SS'ing Clause.

Alright so we all know that you can't special summon if you activate Duality, and if you special summon then you cannot use Duality afterwards. That's great and makes perfect sense. However, it's this one ruling that doesn't make so much sense to me. Apparently, even if you activate an effect that would special summon, but no monsters are actually summoned, you still cannot use PoD. For example, I summon Scrap Chimera, activate effect, and the opponent chains Effect Veiler/Fiendish Chain, which stops the SS, yet I still can't use PoD afterwards. Now let's take another look at PoDs text (I bet ya'll haven't actually read it in so long lol).

Quote:
Reveal the top 3 cards of your Deck, add 1 of them to your hand, then shuffle the rest back into your Deck. You can only activate 1 "Pot of Duality" per turn. You cannot Special Summon a monster(s) during the turn you activate this card.
Quote:
You cannot Special Summon a monster(s) during the turn you activate this card.
Quote:
cannot Special Summon a monster(s)
Quote:
monster(s)


So in order to use this card, I simply can't special summon any monsters. In the example above, where did I special summon a monster(s)? I may have activated an effect to SS a monster, but none were actually summoned. PoD does not say you cannot attempt to special summon, just that you can't special summon, which I didn't. Therefore, I should be able to use PoD, as no monsters were special summoned that turn.

Please, feel free to object and explain why it is the way it is.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:39 PM   #2
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I always assumed that because an attempt has been made to special summon, you are then unable to use Pot of Duality; Even if the special summon is negated.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:44 PM   #3
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I don't think the rule makes much sense, but it's been there since... January of last year. "Pot of Duality" may be activated if a an effect that Special Summons has its activation negated, but not if the effect is negated, or the effect fails to resolve.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:49 PM   #4
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if the effect is negated, and not the activation, its treated as attempting to special summon a monster.

I know it doesn't make too much sense since duality only requires you to not have special summoned, but the idea is you could not have activated chimera if you had previously used duality, so the reverse must hold true to activate duality. You can't do anything before duality that you couldn't do after duality. This includes attempts to special summon them be it inherent summons or card effects.

Negating the "activation" however, will let you use duality. Since its not treated as having been activated.

meh. w/e
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:49 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by dbizal View Post
I always assumed that because an attempt has been made to special summon, you are then unable to use Pot of Duality; Even if the special summon is negated.
If the special summon or the attempt negated, then based on the card's text as shown above you should still be able to activate it afterwards.

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I don't think the rule makes much sense, but it's been there since... January of last year. "Pot of Duality" may be activated if a an effect that Special Summons has its activation negated, but not if the effect is negated, or the effect fails to resolve.
Is there anyway it could be changed?
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:49 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshift View Post
I don't think the rule makes much sense, but it's been there since... January of last year. "Pot of Duality" may be activated if a an effect that Special Summons has its activation negated, but not if the effect is negated, or the effect fails to resolve.
I guess I was wrong.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:50 PM   #7
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Is there anyway it could be changed?
Getting a job in R&D might be a good start.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:55 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joenen View Post
if the effect is negated, and not the activation, its treated as attempting to special summon a monster.

I know it doesn't make too much sense since duality only requires you to not have special summoned, but the idea is you could not have activated chimera if you had previously used duality, so the reverse must hold true to activate duality. You can't do anything before duality that you couldn't do after duality. This includes attempts to special summon them be it inherent summons or card effects.

Negating the "activation" however, will let you use duality. Since its not treated as having been activated.

meh. w/e
Damn, it all makes sense to me now. I didn't think to look at it that way. I guess Konami's smarter than I thought with this kind of stuff. XD
Thanks a lot man!
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Old 02-07-2012, 05:09 PM   #9
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Maybe in Japanese, the card text says something about it?
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Old 02-07-2012, 05:52 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by lolnopound View Post
Maybe in Japanese, the card text says something about it?
Well these rules didn't even apply there until the TCG changed it.
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Old 02-07-2012, 07:37 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Einsam_Delphin View Post
Damn, it all makes sense to me now. I didn't think to look at it that way. I guess Konami's smarter than I thought with this kind of stuff. XD
Thanks a lot man!
I'm glad it helps.

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Old 02-08-2012, 08:29 AM   #12
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Well these rules didn't even apply there until the TCG changed it.
Wait, so the OCG is using this rule too just cause of the TCG?
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:34 AM   #13
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So what about Future Fusion & Pot of Duality. I've heard sides saying I can activate FF, then use PoD, because during that turn FF hasn't tried to special summon, merely paying the cost.

Then I've heard the other side, saying that merely because FF WILL special summon, but is activated at the current turn, PoD cannot be activated.

What is correct here ?
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:41 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by AlphaTheNeko View Post
So what about Future Fusion & Pot of Duality. I've heard sides saying I can activate FF, then use PoD, because during that turn FF hasn't tried to special summon, merely paying the cost.

Then I've heard the other side, saying that merely because FF WILL special summon, but is activated at the current turn, PoD cannot be activated.

What is correct here ?
Did you read this?

http://www.yugioh-card.com/en/gamepl...0517_v1.1x.pdf

I don't understand how someone could argue against Konami's official rulings.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:45 AM   #15
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huh, I don't have a pdf reader on my computer. I'll read it on my phone later.

And i've never seen that pdf, so nope, never read it.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:58 AM   #16
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*sigh*

That means you've never read an official ruling. Doing so does wonders for your understanding of how cards work. These in particular clearly say you can use those two cards in the same turn.
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:07 AM   #17
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Usually if i'm not sure how a card works, I ask my mate what he things since he's a judge and has read the rulings. I just haven't read it myself cus i could never find that pdf.
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:18 AM   #18
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You can check them out here, if you like:

http://www.yugioh-card.com/en/gameplay/
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:16 AM   #19
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What about Scapegoat? This card has been out for ages. Haven't we got any ruling about similar situations with Scapegoat in place of Pot of Duality? Or Summoning a Lava Golem if your Normal Summon is negated?
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:21 AM   #20
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What about Scapegoat? This card has been out for ages. Haven't we got any ruling about similar situations with Scapegoat in place of Pot of Duality? Or Summoning a Lava Golem if your Normal Summon is negated?
People forgot "Scapegoat" existed when "Pot of Duality" came out. It would work the same.
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:30 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by RabbitUp View Post
What about Scapegoat? This card has been out for ages. Haven't we got any ruling about similar situations with Scapegoat in place of Pot of Duality? Or Summoning a Lava Golem if your Normal Summon is negated?
Yo Rabbit! So you are still on here! Nice to see that awesome avatar again! ^_^

Anywho, Scapegoat = Duality in that scenario, and you can summon Lava Golem as your normal summon was negated, meaning it essentially never happened.
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Old 02-08-2012, 07:13 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Einsam_Delphin View Post
Yo Rabbit! So you are still on here! Nice to see that awesome avatar again! ^_^

Anywho, Scapegoat = Duality in that scenario, and you can summon Lava Golem as your normal summon was negated, meaning it essentially never happened.
I don't quite understand why Lava Golem would work. By that logic, I feel that since the normal summon was negated, you could do another one.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:50 PM   #23
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I don't quite understand why Lava Golem would work. By that logic, I feel that since the normal summon was negated, you could do another one.
Good thing we know that you can't, despite my bad wording.
It's the same deal with Duality. If I flip summon say Gravekeeper's Spy and his activation and effect are negated by Solemn Warning, I can then use PoD.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:53 PM   #24
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Good thing we know that you can't, despite my bad wording.
It's the same deal with Duality. If I flip summon say Gravekeeper's Spy and his activation and effect are negated by Solemn Warning, I can then use PoD.
That's completely different. Normal summoning normally doesn't start a chain.
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:00 PM   #25
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That's completely different. Normal summoning normally doesn't start a chain.
How is that relevent to the scenario?
But fine, better example is I summon BLS but it get's warning'd so I can then use PoD afterwards. Same deal.
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