Go Back   Pojo.com Forums > Dragon Ball Z/GT > Dragon Ball / DBZ / GT Anime/Manga Chat
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-03-2017, 06:56 PM   #1
CONTAK
Son of the Prince
 
CONTAK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,163
iTrader: 0
CONTAK is on a distinguished road
Default Lets Redefine Power levels

this might be fun...

Over the course of series we have been placing all the characters into a tier system based on power levels which is an imaginary number assigned to a character to determine which ones are stronger? Better fighters? Better chi manipulators?

So what is a power level? Is having a high power level mean you have more control over chi and can dish out stronger chi blasts? Of course not, the androids didn't have chi and kicked vegeta's ass that may or may not have had more chi. Is a power level something to measure your physical strength, nope! The physical strengths of the characters are too inconsistent to line up with the linear scale system of power levels. Is power level speed? Nope. Than burter would be maximum.

Maybe its all the above. But that doesn't make sense either because that would mean that the androids would have to make up for their lack of chi in strength and speed. Which causes several issues. For instance piccolo's fight with seventeen. If the androids don't have chi and all their battle power comes from strength and speed that means piccolo should have defeated 17. Because in order for piccolo to have matched 17, he had to have been as fast as 17 and he was. Their physical attacks also seemed to do the same amount of damage to each other. So their physical strength and speed seemed to match each other. The only difference, Vegeta was able to sense piccolo's "immense power". That means that piccolo has the androids speed and strength matched plus chi big enough to be sensed as being the strongest fighter on earth. So if power level is all the above, naturally piccolo is stronger in terms of a power level than the androids but he didn't win. So my question is, why are we using power levels? Making charts and guesstimating who is stronger than who in the buu saga using this system that clearly doesn't determine the winner of a battle.

Their physical feats don't line up with what their "battle power" would say they were at. I don't think a "power level" is like a yuioh monster's attack where whoever has the higher one is automatically the victor. If you're response to this would be something along the lines of 'well of course there are other factors like speed, being able to control or sense chi, special abilities, etc' then what is even the point of having a power level system.

In super I could swear that power levels don't even exist anymore. Look at goku and vegeta, they don't train to become stronger, they train to be better fighters with Whis. The way that they spar with Whis makes it seem like they are practicing better form and reflexes than getting a higher power level.

Also look at the cell saga, if we a had a linear advancing power scale system like power levels, how can goku and gohan have become stronger than vegeta just by getting used to the super saiyan form when we know full powered ssj doesn't give the user any form of power boost like the grades did. Obviously it helped take away the strain of being ssj and allowed them to fight better.

And if you were to say well that's what a power level is, a fighter who is better. But over the course of the series there are so many factors that determine the better fighter that I think it wouldn't make sense to give them a number any more than giving marvel or dc a linear scale system.

I could go on but I'd like to open up the discussion here and express more thoughts based on responses.
So anyway I’d like to hear your definition of a power level, and I wouldn’t be surprised if everyone had a different one.
__________________
.
CONTAK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2017, 10:14 AM   #2
Kestral287
Department Head
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,500
iTrader: 0
Kestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant future
Default

The Android aspect of your point is pretty easily handwaved by them using a system analogous to ki without actually being ki. Acknowledge that-- which frankly you almost have to, since they're clearly seen visibly using whatever it is that they use-- and yes, power level pretty easily becomes "all of the above". It's a summation of a person's strength, of their body and ki both.

However, the big thing that there's no way for what we know of power levels to account for is the mind. So yes, there are of course other factors-- one can definitely be outsmarted or be overconfident. That happens repeatedly. It's how Frieza lost his tail to Krillin; it's how Ginyu pulled off the body swap. It's how Buu won half of his battles when he was outmatched. Etc, etc.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roosh View Post
I've been on this website for about 6 years now. The one constant has been Kestral stomping every thread he enters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ku-Ri-Boh View Post
Read Kestral's. He owns my heart.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKpwnage View Post
ITT: Kestral wrecking everyone.
Kestral287 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2017, 12:43 AM   #3
Kangal
Fuel: ▐░░░░
 
Kangal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,796
iTrader: 0
Kangal will become famous soon enoughKangal will become famous soon enough
Default

Outright impossible to redefine power levels at this point.

Power seems to be power, ie Energy.
Wanna go faster? You need more energy.
Wanna hit harder? You need more energy.
Wanna last longer? You need more energy.
Wanna use some special abilities? You need more energy.

Energy/Power/Ki is just currency the fighters use. Obviously more energy doesn't ensure victory.
Good analogy would be a car; a more power full doesn't ensure a car to win in a race.
The traction matters alot too (ie/ skill).
And there's also the element of the driver (ie/ intent).

However, there's almost little to no chance that Yajirobe will win in a fight against Vegeta.
Even whilst wounded, Vegeta's power made him almost impenetrable to Yajirobe.
And the power gaps only grow wider as the series goes on.

However, a weaker opponent could defeat a more powerful opponent if they're crafty or intent (eg driver) and/or have more skill. It just is a rare occurrence.
I mean its quite probable/possible for Tien and Krillin together to defeat Goten and Trunks.
Sure, the kids as SSJ would be more powerful... however these last-gen fighters are much more polished and probably can use their expertise to win the match.

But don't expect Yamcha to beat Hit... that just aint happening.
__________________
Dbz ruined my life, but at least I got a free T-shirt
Lives: ♥XXXX

Click the awesome thread!
Kangal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2017, 04:02 PM   #4
Arkeon
Pojo Veteran
 
Arkeon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,495
iTrader: 0
Arkeon is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CONTAK View Post
this might be fun...

Over the course of series we have been placing all the characters into a tier system based on power levels which is an imaginary number assigned to a character to determine which ones are stronger? Better fighters? Better chi manipulators?

So what is a power level? Is having a high power level mean you have more control over chi and can dish out stronger chi blasts? Of course not, the androids didn't have chi and kicked vegeta's ass that may or may not have had more chi. Is a power level something to measure your physical strength, nope! The physical strengths of the characters are too inconsistent to line up with the linear scale system of power levels. Is power level speed? Nope. Than burter would be maximum.

Maybe its all the above. But that doesn't make sense either because that would mean that the androids would have to make up for their lack of chi in strength and speed. Which causes several issues. For instance piccolo's fight with seventeen. If the androids don't have chi and all their battle power comes from strength and speed that means piccolo should have defeated 17. Because in order for piccolo to have matched 17, he had to have been as fast as 17 and he was. Their physical attacks also seemed to do the same amount of damage to each other. So their physical strength and speed seemed to match each other. The only difference, Vegeta was able to sense piccolo's "immense power". That means that piccolo has the androids speed and strength matched plus chi big enough to be sensed as being the strongest fighter on earth. So if power level is all the above, naturally piccolo is stronger in terms of a power level than the androids but he didn't win. So my question is, why are we using power levels? Making charts and guesstimating who is stronger than who in the buu saga using this system that clearly doesn't determine the winner of a battle.

Their physical feats don't line up with what their "battle power" would say they were at. I don't think a "power level" is like a yuioh monster's attack where whoever has the higher one is automatically the victor. If you're response to this would be something along the lines of 'well of course there are other factors like speed, being able to control or sense chi, special abilities, etc' then what is even the point of having a power level system.

In super I could swear that power levels don't even exist anymore. Look at goku and vegeta, they don't train to become stronger, they train to be better fighters with Whis. The way that they spar with Whis makes it seem like they are practicing better form and reflexes than getting a higher power level.

Also look at the cell saga, if we a had a linear advancing power scale system like power levels, how can goku and gohan have become stronger than vegeta just by getting used to the super saiyan form when we know full powered ssj doesn't give the user any form of power boost like the grades did. Obviously it helped take away the strain of being ssj and allowed them to fight better.

And if you were to say well that's what a power level is, a fighter who is better. But over the course of the series there are so many factors that determine the better fighter that I think it wouldn't make sense to give them a number any more than giving marvel or dc a linear scale system.

I could go on but I'd like to open up the discussion here and express more thoughts based on responses.
So anyway I’d like to hear your definition of a power level, and I wouldn’t be surprised if everyone had a different one.
I get where you coming from man, i truly do but the Android vs Piccolo thing is a unique situation explained by one thing. The androids don't give out chi because they have an energy source that isn't chi based, but produces the effect as if were. So lets say piccolo's chi is X. Android 17's furnace produced strength, speed, and power equal to what piccoo's chi was producing for him. And that sums it up.

Early in the Sayian saga we are shown that a higher power level trumps a lower one. The only exception was when fighters like Goku and Piccolo were able to amplify their chi, by focusing into a single point or attack. They were around 300ish pl but was able to amplify their attacks to powers of 1k and above. To the effect that piccolo was able to kill Radditz who arguably had a power of 1200.

This was held consistently throughout the Freeza saga where the fighters couldn't do anything vs a Freeza with a power level of over a million. And prior to that, we are show time and time again, a fighter with a higher power level defeated a fighter of a lower one. Gohan had his hidden power and allowed him to temporarily increase his power beyond to what was measured.

In the Cell saga, yes, Goku and Gohan did something that did not make sense but it just meant that Goku (which was shown many times before) was able to make more out of his training than Trunks and Vegeta. So Goku and Gohan mastered SSJ (more chi control) and just trained in that form and just got better results than Vegeta and Trunks. ALso seems that once Vegeta and Trunks hit the USSJ mode, they focused on pushing that rather than just training in the normal way. They fell into the trap. Vegeta secretly managed to not go all the way like Trunks did cause he was more aware of the speed drawbacks.

In the buu saga the power levels went through heights that were hard to measure but for the most part, the stronger character won. The exception was buu who had a regenerative factor and required the opponent to be several times stronger than he in order to counter the regeneration.

In Super, yes it seems like they just practicing their skills but make no mistake sparing will increase your power over time. And keep in mind Super is pretty cartoony and you have to take things with a grain of salt. But in general, i feel Chi has been pretty consistent.

Now what it is? imo Chi is a combination of things. It's a spiritual thing, a mind over body concept which is hard to explain. Depending on the race and the discipline the individual can increase their speed and power depending on how they manipulate their chi. The "z-warriors" were able to concentrate their power in one spot to get a "power level" higher than they would normally. Tien was able to use his Tri-beam to keep Semi-Perfect Cell at bay, yet their "base" chi levels were worlds apart. But the attack, he focused his chi + life force to produce a power he would not normally have.

Goku used Kioken to multiply his "power level" temporarily to over power Vegeta at the cost of his stamina and later his chi. There's the other part, a correlation between stamina and chi. There comes a thresh hold where if your stamina is too low, your maximum chi takes a hit. If your chi goes to flat zero you die. Another example is the USSJ form where they are forcing their SSJ form to bulk up in muscle mass and increasing their Chi while expending their chi in an abnormally fast rate while hurting their bodies. Etc. In the end Chi is a little complex but i wouldn't get hung up on the android example.
Arkeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 12:12 AM   #5
CONTAK
Son of the Prince
 
CONTAK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,163
iTrader: 0
CONTAK is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestral287 View Post
The Android Etc, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kangal View Post
Outright impossible to redefine power levels at this point... that just aint happening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkeon View Post
I get where you coming from man, i truly do but the Android vs Piccolo thing is a unique situation explained by one thing.
So the androids use an alternative form of energy from ki to have a high "power level". I find it interesting that even though they have an unlimited supply of this energy, that does not equate to them having an infinite power level. So like Kangal said, a power level is like the over all strength of a car engine, but you need fuel for this engine and it can come in many forms: ki, god ki, buu's ki, android energy, etc. It just so happens that the androids have infinite fuel but it doesn't make their engine infinitely strong.

The thing is Arkeon, the stronger character never really won in the buu saga. Not a single fused character or chou gohan could beat super buu even when they had the "stronger power level". Kid buu was defeated by a technique and not a stronger fighter. You could argue that 'yea buu had the edge because of his absorption', but that's the thing, that I would say half the battles are either won by abilities or some other factor that isn't just the stronger guy won. Which brings me back to one of my points that we put so much into dragonball being all about power levels yet, it seem a good portion of the time it's not always the case.

Look at the saiyan saga, Vegeta wasn't beaten by the stronger fighter. The fight against Vegeta was won due to pure stamina of there being more heroes that can get back up and pick a piece off of Vegeta before he could kill anyone and ultimately couldn't move anymore. In goku's beam struggle against Vegeta, goku came out the stronger warrior with his 4x kaioken yet it did not defeat vegeta. Vegeta then became the strongest with oozaru but ultimately couldn't defeat the heroes due to getting surprised by Yajirobe cutting off his tail. Yes, obviously it's a technicality, but it isn't factored in power levels for some reason. One of my points is that these characters with their traits and abilities are more or than just a number. In a power level chart you would put vegeta oozaru at like 180,000 and Yajirobe at less than raddits, yet yajirobe is able to exploit a weakness in vegeta that can cut his power down ten fold. In Marvel or DC these sort of things are factored but here we just give them a number and call it a day like we are playing magic the gathering cards.

This isn't a one time thing either, this constantly happens through out the series as well. Goku comes down to Namek and is clearly stronger than Ginyu yet the stronger warrior isn't the victor and when Ginyu turns the tables in his favor he isn't the victor either and loses from his own ability. Even freeza didn't lose to being out powered by a stronger warrior, he killed himself twice by not only blowing up the planet but cutting his own body into pieces from his own attack. All goku did was move out of the way.

Why even right something like this

goku ssj (with heart virus) 170,000,000
android 19 160,000,000

When we know goku's ssj power level during his heart virus is irrelevant.

As the series goes on you get even more weird things that pop up that seem to discredit power levels like tien's tribeam, goku's odd training methods in the time chamber, no one can decide which buu is stronger or how strong the boys are, etc.

We haven't really even got to super yet which is really the thing that has gotten me to rethink power levels. Especially with hit and his fight with goku and goku being hit by a lazer beam.

Really what I am getting at is I don't think power levels are relevant anymore and ultimately the better fighter is the one who wins.
__________________
.

Last edited by CONTAK : 01-10-2017 at 12:14 AM.
CONTAK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 08:11 AM   #6
Kestral287
Department Head
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,500
iTrader: 0
Kestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant future
Default

Power levels were literally never relevant. There is no "anymore".

It's no different than trying to put power levels on Fairy Tail or Fullmetal Alchemist or any other anime of this nature. It just so happens that it was mentioned off-hand a few times early on and fans latched onto it.

Fights are written for dramatic effect. Goku loses to Ginyu because it creates tension without worfing Goku. Frieza winds up killing himself to prove a point about accepting defeat. Vegeta 'loses' to Yajirobe to demonstrate the importance of the little guy. if they were decided by whose numbers were bigger there would be zero tension in all of DBZ.

Because again: power levels cannot (or at least, do not) account for mentalities. We know that from Ginyu quite directly, but it's very obvious from watching the show. They also, as Buu demonstrates, have trouble accounting for unique abilities.

So yes, power levels indicate that Vegeta is stronger than Piccolo at point X in the anime, but no, that doesn't mean and never has meant that Vegeta would beat Piccolo in a fight. He would have an inherent advantage to be sure: he can hit harder, he's faster, and on paper he can tank more hits-- though Piccolo being a Namekian means that the last point is very open to discussion. But Piccolo could still most definitely win the fight by doing something that Vegeta doesn't expect.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roosh View Post
I've been on this website for about 6 years now. The one constant has been Kestral stomping every thread he enters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ku-Ri-Boh View Post
Read Kestral's. He owns my heart.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKpwnage View Post
ITT: Kestral wrecking everyone.
Kestral287 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 10:52 AM   #7
Arkeon
Pojo Veteran
 
Arkeon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,495
iTrader: 0
Arkeon is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CONTAK View Post
So the androids use an alternative form of energy from ki to have a high "power level". I find it interesting that even though they have an unlimited supply of this energy, that does not equate to them having an infinite power level. So like Kangal said, a power level is like the over all strength of a car engine, but you need fuel for this engine and it can come in many forms: ki, god ki, buu's ki, android energy, etc. It just so happens that the androids have infinite fuel but it doesn't make their engine infinitely strong.

The thing is Arkeon, the stronger character never really won in the buu saga. Not a single fused character or chou gohan could beat super buu even when they had the "stronger power level". Kid buu was defeated by a technique and not a stronger fighter. You could argue that 'yea buu had the edge because of his absorption', but that's the thing, that I would say half the battles are either won by abilities or some other factor that isn't just the stronger guy won. Which brings me back to one of my points that we put so much into dragonball being all about power levels yet, it seem a good portion of the time it's not always the case.

Look at the saiyan saga, Vegeta wasn't beaten by the stronger fighter. The fight against Vegeta was won due to pure stamina of there being more heroes that can get back up and pick a piece off of Vegeta before he could kill anyone and ultimately couldn't move anymore. In goku's beam struggle against Vegeta, goku came out the stronger warrior with his 4x kaioken yet it did not defeat vegeta. Vegeta then became the strongest with oozaru but ultimately couldn't defeat the heroes due to getting surprised by Yajirobe cutting off his tail. Yes, obviously it's a technicality, but it isn't factored in power levels for some reason. One of my points is that these characters with their traits and abilities are more or than just a number. In a power level chart you would put vegeta oozaru at like 180,000 and Yajirobe at less than raddits, yet yajirobe is able to exploit a weakness in vegeta that can cut his power down ten fold. In Marvel or DC these sort of things are factored but here we just give them a number and call it a day like we are playing magic the gathering cards.

This isn't a one time thing either, this constantly happens through out the series as well. Goku comes down to Namek and is clearly stronger than Ginyu yet the stronger warrior isn't the victor and when Ginyu turns the tables in his favor he isn't the victor either and loses from his own ability. Even freeza didn't lose to being out powered by a stronger warrior, he killed himself twice by not only blowing up the planet but cutting his own body into pieces from his own attack. All goku did was move out of the way.

Why even right something like this

goku ssj (with heart virus) 170,000,000
android 19 160,000,000

When we know goku's ssj power level during his heart virus is irrelevant.

As the series goes on you get even more weird things that pop up that seem to discredit power levels like tien's tribeam, goku's odd training methods in the time chamber, no one can decide which buu is stronger or how strong the boys are, etc.

We haven't really even got to super yet which is really the thing that has gotten me to rethink power levels. Especially with hit and his fight with goku and goku being hit by a lazer beam.

Really what I am getting at is I don't think power levels are relevant anymore and ultimately the better fighter is the one who wins.
The infinite power battery the androids had gave them unlimited stamina and maintained their power level. It doesn't mean they can indefinitely increase their power. Android 19 and 20 had the ability to increase their power so long as they absorbed it, but it wasn't infinite stamina. We have to take everything in context right?

As for the Buu Saga, yes the stronger character didn't win. Because Super Buu was stronger than Kid buu but Goku ended up winning with the spirit bomb even though he was weaker than Chou Gohan. Again this is also a situational moment. They were facing an opponent who can 1. Regenerate and 2. Absorb other people. So yes, with these two things he was able to trump those with higher power and win when in another occasion he would have lost.

So even though he won, it doesn't mean a higher power level can't beat a lower one. It just means he and an additional ability that (even having a high power level) would help him win. Basically he wasn't' fighting fairly, he clearly had a huge advantage.

Also we can't ignore Vegetto would have killed him very easily and so would have Gohan. But 1, Vegetto decided to go inside buu to save his friends and Gohan decided to take his time ( which resulted in Gotenks being absorbed.). It's also arguable that Goku could have killed fat buu but he wouldn't cause he wanted the future generation to take care of their own affairs.


1. Piccolo defeated Radditz (concentrated his beam)
2. Vegeta killed a saibaman
3. Piccolo Killed a Saibaman
4. Krillen Killed mulitple Siabamen.
4. Nappa killed Tien.
5. Vegeta Killed Nappa.
6. Vegeta killed Cui.
7. Vegeta Killed Dodoria.
8. Vegeta Killed Zarbon after getting a Zenkai.
9. Vegeta killed multiple nameks.
10. Dodoria killed multiple nameks.
11. Vegeta killed Guldo.
12. Vegeta killed Jeiece.
13. Vegeta killed the rest of the ginyu force after they were exahusted from getting owned by Goku.
14. Freeza killed Krillen.
15. Freeza defeated Piccolo after transforming to form 3.
16. Freeza killed Vegeta.
17. Goku defeated multiple opponents with a higher power level.
18. Trunks killed Freeza and King Cold
19. Android 20 almost killed Yamacha (Senzu bean saved him).
20. Cell Killed Goku
21. Gohan killed Cell
22. Goku killed light absorbing moster
23. Vegeta killed pui pui.
24. Buu killed Dabura.
25. Buu killed babidi.
26. Buu killed mulitple people including the entire earth.

etc...

Those are all instances where the person had a high power level or amplified their power to get a higher power level and killed/defeated their opponent(s).

Very few moments where weaker opponents defeated or killed stronger ones.

Last edited by Arkeon : 01-10-2017 at 11:02 AM.
Arkeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 05:02 PM   #8
CONTAK
Son of the Prince
 
CONTAK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,163
iTrader: 0
CONTAK is on a distinguished road
Default

@Kestral
@Arkeon

Good points, you guys aren't wrong, but there is something I am still not satisfied with power levels. I know the show is inconsistent and the creator doesn't take this that seriously, but for the sake of argument lets pretend that inside the world of z that there is a logical explanation for every occurrence.

I'm having a hard time trying to collect my thoughts and write it down for this subject so I think I will slow it down to one sub-subject at a time.

One thing I had been curious about is tanking. We know that if someone is caught off guard they can be wounded by an attack from a weaker opponent.

Krillin's destructo disk could have killed nappa
Yajirobi was able to cut vegeta's tail off
Krillin was able to cut Frieza's tail off
tien was able to hold Cell down
Vegeta and goku were able to blast large chunks off of cell with Kamehameha and final flash
Normal goku was able to cut super buu in half with destructo disk and there have been numerous times in which buu has been "wounded" by weaker fighters.
Finally the big one, super saiyan blue goku was wounded by a lazer gun

The only thing I want anyone to take from this list is that clearly fighters are vulnerable from weaker attacks if they aren't careful enough.

My question is then, what is going on when a character out right tanks an attack just by standing there and not doing anything and only their clothes are damaged if any. The only example I can think of is nappa tanking chouzu's self destruction but I know there are others. If characters can be hurt no matter what by taking no action how is it that they can in some instances seem invulnerable to attacks by taking no action?
__________________
.
CONTAK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 03:00 PM   #9
Kestral287
Department Head
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,500
iTrader: 0
Kestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant futureKestral287 has a brilliant future
Default

Most of the time when somebody ignores the direct hit they're paying attention to it. The big exceptions are things like Vegeta Final Flashing Cell, where Cell clearly underestimated the attack.

My personal theory, which is of course nothing more than that, is that one can use ki defensively to protect themselves from attacks. But that's not an unconscious thing; they have to see it coming. They also have to be willing to expend that much ki, which most of the time would frankly just be lazy. So it's only used when they're far stronger than the opponent.

The other thing to note is that almost all of the attacks you just listed (save the ones regarding Cell) were piercing or cutting attacks. That brings up a host of potential answers, but of course everything is speculation.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roosh View Post
I've been on this website for about 6 years now. The one constant has been Kestral stomping every thread he enters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ku-Ri-Boh View Post
Read Kestral's. He owns my heart.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKpwnage View Post
ITT: Kestral wrecking everyone.

Last edited by Kestral287 : 01-12-2017 at 12:04 PM.
Kestral287 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 02:15 AM   #10
Kangal
Fuel: ▐░░░░
 
Kangal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,796
iTrader: 0
Kangal will become famous soon enoughKangal will become famous soon enough
Default

Here's a question; can Beerus be killed by a Sorbet's laser ring via a headshot when he is sleeping??
__________________
Dbz ruined my life, but at least I got a free T-shirt
Lives: ♥XXXX

Click the awesome thread!
Kangal is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

 
Advertisements


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.