For the deuces that insist

[Blade007]

Not really. Both vegeta and trunks are post rosat 2.

[NeoZenithX]

Originally Posted by Blade007

Ok. Here is the thing - 200 is Goku's Power level (manga wise). In the movie he should still have his toei power up which I'm not including atm.

About Broly's omega blaster. I'm not sure if it's amplified. The KHH beam from ssj2 goku/gohan and ssj goten didn't do anything to broly. It simply had ridiculously high concussive force (similar to tien's tri-beam which pushed cell back). The beam couldn't even penetrate through broly's barrier (to add the fact he didn't have enough time to power up his ki shield). He was blasted into the core of sun unscratched.
That right there proves - Broly > KHH Beam >> Saiyans


EDIT: Offcourse - SSJ3 Goku (M12) > SSJ3 Goku (M10) >>> SSJ3 Goku (Manga)

Okay, so if we are using SSJ3 Goku's movie PL, he alone could push Broly into the sun with merely a fraction of his power.

Also, if SSJ2 Gohan enraged is at 2,880, then his KHH could approximately be between 6,394 (~2.22x) and 11,520 (~4x). That is far greater than Broly's 4,500.

Either way, it doesn't add up.

[Victorious]

And BLADE, Vegeta's blast is definitely weaker than Cell..it's just not way way weaker than Cell. So much to the point of he can tank like Broly did to Goku's KHH. He still tanked, he just had to brace himself. Kinda like how Raditz had to put up a hand to block Goku's KHH which was 75% of his own power.

[Super Vegetto]

Base Trunks Movie 8
http://oi41.tinypic.com/15ewxg5.jpg
ASSJ Trunks Movie 8
http://oi42.tinypic.com/sqpoxz.jpg

Base Vegeta Movie 8
http://oi40.tinypic.com/14wwp09.jpg
ASSJ Vegeta Movie 8
http://oi42.tinypic.com/9ga92d.jpg

[NeoZenithX]

I don't recall either Vegeta or Trunks looking that buff in M8, but especially Vegeta.

[Super Vegetto]

Well yea Vegeta looks buff in movie 8 and also in character sketch.

Trunks rips his jacket because of muscle growth wich is pretty much factor from ASSJ form. Also in character sketch he doesnt have buff arms like in his ASSJ character sketch.

[Victorious]

When SPC braced himself against Vegeta, all Broly haters cried out in agony. lol

Sorry guys we've got you on a stick, To quote Neo-Cooler
"If Cell was bracing himself and making an angry stressed face it means he was affected by a weaker attack than one Broly took to the face and laughed at. Sorry but Broly is clearly superior."

End discussion.

[Blade007]

Originally Posted by NeoZenithX

Okay, so if we are using SSJ3 Goku's movie PL, he alone could push Broly into the sun with merely a fraction of his power.

Also, if SSJ2 Gohan enraged is at 2,880, then his KHH could approximately be between 6,394 (~2.22x) and 11,520 (~4x). That is far greater than Broly's 4,500.

Either way, it doesn't add up.

Yeah SSJ3 Toei Goku would easily **** broly upside down. About gohan - well 2880 is gohan's power level when he is in mint condition. He should be weaker when firing KHH. It's pretty much Goku's power IMO when he amps up to ssj2. I like to believe he didn't use his full power (like he powered up in m8 post toei power up), but if I use amplification for individual characters (goku/gohan and goten) that would make KHH insanely powerful which IMO is going too extreme.

To quote myself from Neo -

Broly M10
~ Base - 20
~ SSJ - 200
~ LSSJ (Power Displayed) - 28000
~ Full Power - Unknown

Gohan
~ Base - 190
~ SSJ - 1900
~ SSJ2 - 7600
~ Enraged - 19000

Goku
~ Base - 10
~ SSJ - 100
~ SSJ2 - 400
~ SSJ3 - 1600

~ Family Kamehameha (3.5x)- 91000

~ M13 SSJ2 Goku - 30000

~ M13 SSJ3 Goku - 150000

Originally Posted by Victorious

And BLADE, Vegeta's blast is definitely weaker than Cell..it's just not way way weaker than Cell. So much to the point of he can tank like Broly did to Goku's KHH. He still tanked, he just had to brace himself. Kinda like how Raditz had to put up a hand to block Goku's KHH which was 75% of his own power.

Offcourse it's weaker that's what I said. I believe its around 55-60% of SPC so that's not the tanking range, but yeah. It might scratch him or hurt him slightly if he doesn't brace.

[CatouttaHell]

Originally Posted by Blade007

I don't see how you've goten and trunks above ssj3 goku COH? They didn't do anything.

Son Goten Post-Zenkai was able to even out the Kamehameha struggle when he joined in. Before that Broly was completely dominating.

Additional Comment:

Originally Posted by Victorious

Yo COH, why you have Vegeta in 2nd grade in movie 8? He only fights in SSJ in the Cell games right?

Looks like SSjinG2 to me, and the fight against Broly makes him look insanely weak (though the same fight makes even Gohan look weaker than Piccolo so that doesn't prove much...)

[Super Vegetto]

Well Vegeta is much stronger than lets say first time he used final flash against Perfect Cell.

This blast could probably have big multiply for Cell bracing himself, or its simply Vegetas moment where AT made Vegeta to be something on Cell games, and not like other that didnt do anything exept getting beating from Cell juniors.

Btw highest i would put Broly Movie 8 against manga character is equal to FP Perfect Cell. SPC is imo overating.

[Victorious]

Originally Posted by Super Vegetto

Well Vegeta is much stronger than lets say first time he used final flash against Perfect Cell.

This blast could probably have big multiply for Cell bracing himself, or its simply Vegetas moment where AT made Vegeta to be something on Cell games, and not like other that didnt do anything exept getting beating from Cell juniors.

Btw highest i would put Broly Movie 8 against manga character is equal to FP Perfect Cell. SPC is imo overating.

LSSJ Broly ate MSSJ Goku's KHH to the face, didnt brace himself or nothing.
SPC had to brace against a ki attack from Vegeta.

How can you say LSSJ Broly is weaker than SPC, when just going by feats he's stronger? C'mon now man.

[CatouttaHell]

Going by normal logic LSSjin Broly shouldn't be able to touch SPC until Movie 10.

Going by hax logic I wouldn't be surprised if SSjin Broly M10 was multi-food SPC.

[Blade007]

Originally Posted by CatouttaHell

Son Goten Post-Zenkai was able to even out the Kamehameha struggle when he joined in. Before that Broly was completely dominating.

Not really. He merely slowed it down and had to focus the beam at point, but the gap could've been 10% so I don't think that's enough to prove goten is above ssj3 goku. I mean that would put base gohan leagues above kid buu lol.

And here is the thing - when goku fires his own KHH it doesn't affect the beam struggle. So, unless you believe goten > goku then.........!

[Victorious]

Well going by hax logic I can't see movie 8 Broly being weaker than Fat Buu..that's like my minimum for Movie 8 LSSJ Broly.


I never saw anything of much in the beam struggle..Broly just seemed like he was dominating the entire time, until base Trunks ***** him up, lol

[CatouttaHell]

Son Goten could be >>> Son Goku. Nothing says Son Goku was haxed too.

[Blade007]

I don't think broly is that powerful in m8. Even if he go by KHH tanking he should be around ssj2 kid gohan's strength. Nothing really suggests he is fat buu tier imo.

Unless you include toei punch. So, lets say if toei punch is 10x amplified and broly survived the punch (which he did offcourse) that would put him 8-10x stronger than post toei power up mssj goku which is insane by m10 standards. He would be around buutenks-buuhan level lol.

[Victorious]

The insane bloat in the Buu arc pretty much makes sure that he's not getting up to Ultimate Gohan levels

I mean

Ulitmate Gohan > SSJ3 Gotenks > SSJ Gotenks [post] > base Gotenks [post] > SSJ Gotenks [Piccolo expectations] > SSJ Gotenks [post] > SSJ3 Goku

[CatouttaHell]

Yeah I have Gotenks like 1,500x stronger than Son Goku. Even if I went for Vegeta being Cell Games in Movie 8, etc I still wouldn't have Broly anywhere near Ultimate Gohan even if I wanted to.

[Super Vegetto]

Going by Toei logic, SSJ2 Kid Gohan can reflect Special beam cannon that has big multiply + stoping Kienzan with his power.

Also his movment when Cell fires rapid fire atk cant be detected.

I dont think that Broly movie 8 stands a chance against Gohan ( Cell games ).

I dont hate Broly but also i cant see him that much powerful.

[Victorious]

I don't think broly is that powerful in m8. Even if he go by KHH tanking he should be around ssj2 kid gohan's strength. Nothing really suggests he is fat buu tier imo.

If his RSSJ is already > MSSJ Kid Gohan..and then his LSSJ transformation is greater than a base to SSJ2..how can you say he's not much SSJ2 Kid Gohan canon tier?...He's should be higher than a hypothetical SSJ3 Kid Gohan.

Additional Comment:

Going by Toei logic, SSJ2 Kid Gohan can reflect Special beam cannon that has big multiply

Yeah, one that's instantly fired off..going by TOEI logic it takes about 5 minutes to fire off a fully charged one.

+ stoping Kienzan with his power.

Nothing wrong with stopping an attack with a burst of ki. It's never really been tried before against a Kienzan manga wise so it works and doesn't really contradict anything.

Also his movment when Cell fires rapid fire atk cant be detected

A feat base Goku [well under 85,000] did against the Ginyus. Probably a feat a guy with a 1.5x or so gap can do.