Naruto Shippuuden: Manga Discussion XXI

[Perentie Fan]

Originally Posted by TheLastSaiyan

Personally, I think Itachi was blatantly lying to Sasuke about how over the course of their history and throughout generations Uchiha's would kill their best friend to gain MS and then kill their siblings and take their eyes for EMS. It does not support the claim about MS being a scarce rarity in Uchiha history (which we have seen to be true as it did not really get out in the open until the massacre). Not to mention Itachi told Sasuke there had only been two true MS users (not counting himself, though I'm not sure if he counted Izuna at this point) in the clans history. If there had been more MS users everyone would have known about it and you would have quite a few people running around with EMS which was hardly the case.

As far as we know Madara is the only one who ever had EMS. However, when you refer to Itachi saying that there were two others I believe he was talking about the present time, not the entire history of the clan.

Hence his words as I recall when he spoke of Sasuke attaining MS was that if he did "there will be three," which in the context had no reason to refer to the entire history of the Uchiha but rather to what Sasuke would face at the time if he gained MS.

I doubt the Uchiha were as "blood-thirsty" as he made them out to be as there are quite a few things that go against that idea.

Except Itachi is not the only one to claim it. Obviously there were many exceptions, but according to Madara the ancestor of the Uchihas also believed the only effective way of accomplishing things was through violence and gaining power, with no room for compromise or empathy.

[TheLastSaiyan]

Originally Posted by Perentie Fan

As far as we know Madara is the only one who ever had EMS. However, when you refer to Itachi saying that there were two others I believe he was talking about the present time, not the entire history of the clan.

Hence his words as I recall when he spoke of Sasuke attaining MS was that if he did "there will be three," which in the context had no reason to refer to the entire history of the Uchiha but rather to what Sasuke would face at the time if he gained MS.

True enough, but even if I go by Madara (which is becoming increasingly difficult since his skills at bending the truth are second to none though I'm sure he was honest about this). He and Izuna were the only MS users in the clans history (until Itachi) and they were it's leaders. If there had been anymore MS users Madara would have definitely known about them and acted accordingly. The way things were turning out with the clan diminishing over the years it's looking pretty certain that Itachi was the first real MS user in a LONG time since Madara. Itachi said Madara was his teacher making it clear he taught him all about MS (well, all he felt needed to be known anyway) as well as how to unlock it, leading to the death of Shisui (whom may have known something about what was going on). By this time MS was becoming a highly coveted secret, when Sasuke asked his father about it he seemed hesitant to even tell him about it and changed the subject.

This Uchiha clan while they may have been planning a coup were not trying to kill each other for upgraded eyes. It seemed that only the ones who participated in the "secret clan meetings" even knew about how to obtain it. Because of geniuses like Kakashi we know there's a way to obtain it without killing anyone, though I doubt any of them knew this so they just refrained from it. Madara picking Itachi among other reasons was also because he most likely saw the potential for MS in him. The only other Uchiha who was stated to be among the best of the best in the clan at that time was Shisui and we know he didn't have it.

Except Itachi is not the only one to claim it. Obviously there were many exceptions, but according to Madara the ancestor of the Uchihas also believed the only effective way of accomplishing things was through violence and gaining power, with no room for compromise or empathy.

Oh I agree, I was just saying that there were many that didn't feel that way.

[Perentie Fan]

Originally Posted by TheLastSaiyan

True enough, but even if I go by Madara (which is becoming increasingly difficult since his skills at bending the truth are second to none though I'm sure he was honest about this). He and Izuna were the only MS users in the clans history (until Itachi) and they were it's leaders.

Does it ever say that Madara and his brother were the first to gain MS? I know Madara is called the founder of the Uchiha clan but I take it to mean that he was more the one who united the clan and made it into the world-changing force it became. That is we were never told that Madara was the first Uchiha.

I get your point that its an embellishment to say that the Uchiha lived to kill friends and siblings for power, as many did not, but I think Madara did adopt the philosophy that because doing those things gave the Uchiha greater power it was the path they were "supposed" to take. Hence his talk about fate and also his surprise when the rest of the clan sided with Hashirama over him.

At that time, (along with questioning for what his brother gave up his eyes for if they were only going to ally with enemies) Madara asked himself "where had our hatred gone?"

Perhaps this is why he influenced events to increase the hate shown to Uchiha and the hate the Uchiha felt toward those who monitored them and treated them with suspicion, culminating in Sasuke who has taken on all the hate that has festered in his clan from his childhood till now.

[TheLastSaiyan]

Originally Posted by Perentie Fan

Does it ever say that Madara and his brother were the first to gain MS? I know Madara is called the founder of the Uchiha clan but I take it to mean that he was more the one who united the clan and made it into the world-changing force it became. That is we were never told that Madara was the first Uchiha.

Well, it's true that it never said Madara and his brother were the very first to gain MS it just seemed to imply that to me. As it seems as far the Uchiha knew they were the firsts in their clan's history to gain such a power. As far as Madara being the first Uchiha that's definitely doubtful, because if that's the case what about his parents? Surely one of them was Uchiha defintely. That's why I always thought back on the Hyuuga theory that Kakashi mentioned on the Sharingan being their "distant cousin". So at one point I figured maybe one of the first Uchiha's parents may have been a Hyuuga possibly or maybe some other related blood-kin I dunno. But Madara's stories of the Uchiha seem to have nothing to do with the Hyuuga and vice-versa save for the fact that they both had to have derived from the son with the eye mutation.

They then ended up evolving further into different eye types because of blood mixing, that's the only way right now I see the Hyuuga and Uchiha being connected. As for the first to ever wield sharingan, who knows?
It definitely would be very difficult to believe it started with Madara as there was an Uchiha clan before him. I don't know if it will be clarified or not but it definitely would be interesting to see.

I get your point that its an embellishment to say that the Uchiha lived to kill friends and siblings for power, as many did not, but I think Madara did adopt the philosophy that because doing those things gave the Uchiha greater power it was the path they were "supposed" to take. Hence his talk about fate and also his surprise when the rest of the clan sided with Hashirama over him.

Yeah and I don't know if he intentionally meant to do so when he was telling Sasuke the story, but he definitely implied that Uchiha's strength meant more to him than anything and he was willing to DO anything to make sure they kept a place in power.

At that time, (along with questioning for what his brother gave up his eyes for if they were only going to ally with enemies) Madara asked himself "where had our hatred gone?"

Perhaps this is why he influenced events to increase the hate shown to Uchiha and the hate the Uchiha felt toward those who monitored them and treated them with suspicion, culminating in Sasuke who has taken on all the hate that has festered in his clan from his childhood till now.

That sounds very, very likely what he felt and intended to do exact revenge on both.

[Perentie Fan]

Originally Posted by TheLastSaiyan

Yeah and I don't know if he intentionally meant to do so when he was telling Sasuke the story, but he definitely implied that Uchiha's strength meant more to him than anything and he was willing to DO anything to make sure they kept a place in power.

This also may have something to do with his ominous words to Naruto about how he intends to use Sasuke to "show the world what the Uchiha really are."

Which leads to the question of just what precisely does Madara believe they are?

[Jmanunknown]

Spoilers are out and Madara has explained his plan.



full translation of that part by shounensuki:
The coloured cover is two pages wide and has Zabuza, Haku, and all the dead Akatsuki members!

Sakura is getting ready to set out to the Land of Iron. Three people are going, it seems: Sakura, Kiba, and Lee.

Well, to the conference room:
The Raikage uses a momentary oppertunity to attack Sasuke on Madara's shoulder, but [Madara uses] a space-time ninjutsu to send Sasuke somewhere else.
[He] orders Karin to give [Sasuke] medical treatment and sends her away too

From here, the conversation starts:
Gaara: "Why did you make Sasuke come here!?"
Madara: "I sent him here because it's very valuable [to me] that he activate his eyes all the way up to Susanoo. I also planned for him to bring you Five Kage down and imprison you, but it seems that was hopeless yet."
Here ends the conversation about Sasuke
"My goal is to rule the world. I've wished this for a long time."
Tsuchikage: "In your case, you should be able to do that by yourself, right?"
Madara: "My body was too gravely injured in the fight against the First, Hashirama. I don't have such power left."
Someone: "Why are you collecting the Tailed Beasts?"
To the story about the Eye of the Moon Plan:
The origin of the current Tailed Beasts is that they are born from a single Ten-Tails. Temari or Kankurou: "Shouldn't there be only nine Tailed Beasts?"
Madara: "Long ago, the Sage of the Six Paths saved the world from the Ten-Tails, but because the beast's power was so great, the Sage put the demonic power inside his own body, making himself a jinchuuriki. Then, he created the Moon and sealed the Ten-Tails' body there. (the story was much longer, but I can't remember the rest ><) Then, as his own death approached, he divided the power into nine pieces..."
I'm sorry, but I'm telling it extremely simplified
Madara: "[My goal is to] revive the Ten-Tails and become its jinchuuriki, project an infinite Tsukuyomi on the Moon, and so rule all of mankind, thus I will create a world without strife."
Mizukage: "This world has no place for such a dream or hope"
Madara: "Right now, it's neither hope nor anything. Hurry up and hand over the Eight-Tails and Nine-Tails."

To be continued
That's the entire long spoiler


Raikage: "The Eight-Tails!? Bee is still alive?"
Madara: "The capture of the Eight-Tails was a failure. Despite being your younger brother, he is a truly splendid shinobi."
Raikage: "What the hell! I'll bet he took this opportunity to go play somewhere else!! When he comes back, I'll Iron Claw¹ him!!!"
C, Darui: "Something like that was probably what he was thinking about..."

Gaara: "I won't hand over Uzumaki Naruto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Tsuchikage: "Raikage, what about you?" "Of course I won't hand him over!!!!!"
Madara: "Are you okay with a breakdown? If it comes down to war, I don't think you guys will have a great chance of success against the Tailed Beasts"

Gaara: "I won't throw away my dream!!"

Madara: "All right then, I hereby declare the Fourth Great Ninja World War!!"

The end　

¹ Iron Claw (鉄のツメ, Aian Kurō). Probably a technique or something.
That's the smaller spoiler
.

[E-hero guy]

wow this is the climax of the manga i believe. so madara can teleport people at will somewhat but i thought he had to touch them and take them with him. can someone break it down or did i just read wrong

[BlackDragonKing]

Hm. Did NOT see that one comin'.

So Madara intends to use the Bijuu to fight his war, or what? Doesn't that carry the risk that the Bijuu will get sealed again?

I mean, Madara, Zetsu, and Kisame together are nothing to sneeze at, but that's not much of an army against the entire world. o_O

[feelthepein]

I'm with BlackDragon, that completely came from left field.

HOWEVER, I like this idea, a lot, for one big reason: by bringing out the seven other tailed beasts, there is no question that the ninjas we have yet to hear much out of in Part II will have their opportunity to shine. Going up against the tailed beasts is near impossible if you're alone unless you're like someone on Kisame's level, which is quite rare. There's also really no pre-determined matchups I can think of except maybe Gaara vs. the one-tail (though I have no clue if Gaara's strong enough to defeat it alone) so that allows for Kishi to pick and choose whoever without any of us really being disappointed as long as everyone gets time to shine.

I also think it'll be interesting to see where Killerbee fits into all this. Will he go up against a tailed-beast or will he ultimately go after someone like Madara or will he just stay on the sidelines and focus on his rap career?

[BlackDragonKing]

Originally Posted by feelthepein

I'm with BlackDragon, that completely came from left field.

HOWEVER, I like this idea, a lot, for one big reason: by bringing out the seven other tailed beasts, there is no question that the ninjas we have yet to hear much out of in Part II will have their opportunity to shine. Going up against the tailed beasts is near impossible if you're alone unless you're like someone on Kisame's level, which is quite rare. There's also really no pre-determined matchups I can think of except maybe Gaara vs. the one-tail (though I have no clue if Gaara's strong enough to defeat it alone) so that allows for Kishi to pick and choose whoever without any of us really being disappointed as long as everyone gets time to shine.

I also think it'll be interesting to see where Killerbee fits into all this. Will he go up against a tailed-beast or will he ultimately go after someone like Madara or will he just stay on the sidelines and focus on his rap career?

You bring up some good points here, Feelthepein. I'm actually really excited about this. =D

I predict a meeting between Naruto and Hachibi is in the works. Hacibi can control the Bijuu, so he is a vital piece of the puzzle, and as the last two Jinchuuriki, it would be odd if the series passed without Naruto encountering him.

I suspect Naruto might help Hachibi change his reckless decision-making and realize that he's needed to help in the war. He'd be a powerful ally, and I'm still not convinced there's nothing Hachibi can do to help Naruto with the Kyuubi...

[feelthepein]

good call, completely forgot about the Naruto-Hachibi meeting. It is necessary, and aside from a Kakashi-Sasuke reunion it's probably one of the more anticipated encounters we have. Though I'm not sure how Hachibi could help Naruto control the Kyuubi. I could definitely see Hachibi being one of those who can do it, but can't teach it people or doesn't know how he can. I do agree that Hachibi (and the Raikage for that matter) could be the deciding factors as to the outcome of the war.

Random question, but who captured the 7-tails?

[Anko]

Originally Posted by feelthepein

good call, completely forgot about the Naruto-Hachibi meeting. It is necessary, and aside from a Kakashi-Sasuke reunion it's probably one of the more anticipated encounters we have. Though I'm not sure how Hachibi could help Naruto control the Kyuubi. I could definitely see Hachibi being one of those who can do it, but can't teach it people or doesn't know how he can. I do agree that Hachibi (and the Raikage for that matter) could be the deciding factors as to the outcome of the war.

Random question, but who captured the 7-tails?

Wasn't that Kisame himself? I think that was revealed that Itachi met up with Kisame and Kisame complained that the tailed beast was hard to deal with, all by himself.

[UNTOUCHABLE/DADE]

thks J man


Just wOW!!!

Madara, what are you thinking, can your body really handle the power of a beast, that has all the tailed beast chakra combine?

2nd If the moon cracks isn't that like the end of the world lol.

Madara's plan just forces the other nations to work together, I wonder who wanted to do that in the first place... um...um... "Danzo". One world dictatorship.

[Starshipw]

First we find out why Sasuke wouldn't take Sakura with him. By the time she got packed the Sound ninja would have gotten bored and gone home.

Second, the last dozen chapters are “Oh, never mind, this has just been a test of the Sasuke Susanoo system.”

Third, Raikage learns KillerBee not dead. Is the wanted poster still out on Sasuke or do we just forget all the havoc he caused? (Havoc that looks more and more like under Madara's influence.)

Fourth, GO HASHIRAMA! YOU THE MAN. The First beat the heck out of Tobi. Does he still even have a permanent solid body? I assume he does since he was Mizukage all those years.

Five, Ten-Tail has got to be a dragon that eats the moon.

Six, Eye of the Moon Plan is to genjutsu whole world!? Tsukuyomi = God of the Moon

Seven, During the Fourth World War the Five Great Ninja Nations unite behind the two most powerful generals... A Rapper and an unpredictable Idiot. Tsunade's taking all bets.

[BlackDragonKing]

It's a shame. If the First Hokage was here, the war would be over in ten minutes.

We'll need to make do with his spiritual successor, I suppose. XD

[Near]

God, another well-intentioned extremist?

And here I thought he was all butthurt over being rejected by everyone and wanted to make the world his slave as part of his revenge...

Also the whole 10 tails and Uchiha whoring sounds like something out of a bad fanfic.

On a happier note, Raikage learns Killerbee is alive, we learn Madara is pretty weak [Offensively, naturally] and explanation for whole arc.

[BlackDragonKing]

Originally Posted by Near

God, another well-intentioned extremist?

And here I thought he was all butthurt over being rejected by everyone and wanted to make the world his slave as part of his revenge...

Also the whole 10 tails and Uchiha whoring sounds like something out of a bad fanfic.

On a happier note, Raikage learns Killerbee is alive, we learn Madara is pretty weak [Offensively, naturally] and explanation for whole arc.

Don't be fooled by the self-righteous posturing, Madara's no more well-intentioned than he ever was.

Creating a strife-free world by using demonic powers to establish a dictatorship based on mass hypnosis is hardly well-intentioned, in my book.

[Near]

Originally Posted by BlackDragonKing

Don't be fooled by the self-righteous posturing, Madara's no more well-intentioned than he ever was.

Creating a strife-free world by using demonic powers to establish a dictatorship based on mass hypnosis is hardly well-intentioned, in my book.

It's well-intentioned - he wants peace, after all.
It's just the means [Hypnosis, dictatorship] that are extreme and that we find unjust.

Copy pasta from Pain, basically.

[BlackDragonKing]

I read this more as "no strife" in nobody will stop him from making the world his b¡tch, since he's the CAUSE of the strife in the first place.

[E-hero guy]

i found kind of funny that madara is like hand over what i want and i slave the world or we fight and i own the world too lol

[Perentie Fan]

Originally Posted by Starshipw

First we find out why Sasuke wouldn't take Sakura with him. By the time she got packed the Sound ninja would have gotten bored and gone home.

It hasn't been THAT long. Also it seems to me that they are on their way, not just starting.

Second, the last dozen chapters are “Oh, never mind, this has just been a test of the Sasuke Susanoo system.”

I wonder just what Madara means by "I need to stock up on good eyes" in reference to raising Sasuke's powers. After all, in his explanation of the Moon's Eye Plan he gave no role at all to Sasuke.

Madara is leaving some stuff out I'd wager, like always. He is smart enough surely to know the kages would not agree to handing over the world to him. Not to mention that they have no current authority to give him Naruto (who is not of their countries) or Killer Bee (whose location is currently unknown).

Not to mention Madara just came from speaking with Naruto and then he asks for Naruto? Yes... I think there is more to his plans than what he is telling the kages. I think they are unknowingly playing right into his hands.

Originally Posted by BlackDragonKing

It's a shame. If the First Hokage was here, the war would be over in ten minutes.

We'll need to make do with his spiritual successor, I suppose. XD

Again and again people on forums talk like Hashirama beat Madara with ease. I don't see how this can be true.

I mean their battle created a FREAKING VALLEY!!!!! Not to mention Hashirama had a big advantage in being able to render Kyuubi useless to Madara. I suspect it was a very close fight.

Originally Posted by Near

It's well-intentioned - he wants peace, after all.
It's just the means [Hypnosis, dictatorship] that are extreme and that we find unjust.

Copy pasta from Pain, basically.

Except that we just heard Madara agree with Naruto that he DOESN'T CARE about peace. At best speaking of it was just a halfhearted effort to make the kages agree. As Tsuchikage said, it sounds more like he is taking the world for himself.

Incidentally a more detailed and accurate spoiler has been posted since the one Jmanunknown put up. A number of things make more sense in it than they did in the spoiler posted here. For one Tsuchikage does not suggest Madara once had the power rule the world, nor does Madara say it was his dream to rule the world back in those days. Also, Madara does not state that he wanted Sasuke to beat and imprison the kages, but rather to weaken them so that Madara could take them hostage. I'll post that spoiler below, let me know if I'm breaking any rules:

Part 1:

我、愚かな弟が買っといてくれたよ。
My foolish youngerbrother bought it.

ジャンプ表紙は、一楽ラーメン食べてるナルト
The front cover of the Jump issue is of Naruto eating Ichiraku Ramen.

１０月10日なナルトの誕生日＆連載10周年達成記念カラー！！
In color to celebrate October 10 as Naruto's birthday and the series' 10th anniversary.

サイ『鉄の国に入ったらナルトくんの探索…お願いしますよ…キバ』
Sai: After we enter the Iron Country, please...search for Naruto, Kiba
キバ『分かってんよ！』
Kiba: Understood!
神妙な顔のサクラ
Sakura is quiet/faithful.
キバ『ハア…』
Kiba: Ha...
リー『どうしたんです？』
Lee: What's going on?
キバ『いのは泣いてるだけだったってのに　サクラはこの覚悟だ…
ナルトに何て切り出すのかは知らねーが…　気不味い雰囲気になるのは
間違いねーからよ』
Kiba: Ino just cried back there, yet Sakura and her resolve...I don't know if she's going to cut it off with Naruto but, the mood has definitely become awkward.
リー『…　サクラさんにも色々考えがあるんだと思います』
Lee: ...Sakura must be thinking about a lot of things I can imagine.
キバ『しかし４人１組が…基本だからって…　探索任務だとオレだもんよ
それに…　秘密裏にってのがサイの”注文”…　”根”の尾行確認までオレの鼻まかせだぜ』
Kiba: However with 4 people as 1 team...to me, this is supposed to be a basic search mission, however, in secret, these are Sai's orders...leave it to my nose to track Root.

カラー巻頭　マダラ、キミマロ、カブト、オロチマル、カクズ、イタチ、キサメ。デイダラ、
白、ザブザ、ナルト、サクラ、ガアラ、カカシ、ジライヤ、サイ
Color cover featuring Madara, Kimimaro, Kabuto, Orochimaru, Kakuzu, Itachi, Kisame, Deidara, Haku, Zabuza, Naruto, Sakura, Gaara, Kakashi, Jiraiya, and Sai.

巻頭に
On the Cover
忍の業に導かれ、刃を交えし闘いの日々。　そして迎える新時代―
Blades clashing everyday, guide the Shinobi's deeds. And also welcome a new age.
467　宣戦
Chapter 467: Declaration of War
ナルトの思いは今…
Naruto's thoughts are now...

宿主『なんて事をしてくれやがったんだコラ！これだから忍は！』
Innkeeper: What the hell did you guys do here! It's because of this SHinobi are...!
ヤマト『す…すみません　私がちゃんと直しておきますから…』
Yamato: So...sorry I will make sure to fix it...

雪降る屋根の上にナルト。見つめるカカシ
The snow falling, Naruto is on the roof. Kakashi watches him.

ナルト、マダラの言葉を思い出す。
Naruto recalls Madara's words.
マダラ『サスケは　うちはの憎しみを全て背負い…　その憎しみの呪おを
世界へぶつけるつもりだ　最も強い武器であり友であり…力である憎しみ
それがサスケの忍道だ！！　サスケ自身がそう選択したのさ』
Madara: Sasuke is burdened with all the hate of the Uchiha...he intends to strike the world with this hate. Sasuke himself has chosen this.

ナルト『もう…直接（サスケ）会ってみるしかねーんだ』
Naruto: There's nothing left to do but to directly confront Sasuke.

白ゼツ顔に穴開いてる絵。
There's a picture of white Zetsu's head from an opening in a hole.

雷影『シーの見た通り火影はやはり逃げたようだな！』
Raikage: It's as Shii has seen, the Hokage seems to have run for it!
土影『うむ…サスケのせいでな』
Tsuchikage: Yeah, it's Sasuke's fault.

マダラ『！』
Madara: !
雷影が、マダラにパンチ
The Raikage punches Madara.
雷影『！！？』
Raikage: !!?
パンチ食らうが、マダラの顔の面が渦巻いて
サスケが面の中に吸い込まれていく。
The punch connected but Madara's mask vanishes like a whirpool with Sasuke getting sucked in with it.

雷影『”暁”の計画など…どうせろくなもんではない！理解できん！』
Raikage: Akatsuki's plan...there's no way I'll understand/approve!
吸い込まれてくの見てビックリ、カリン（！！　サスケが…！！）
Karin is surprised to see them disappear and thinks (!! Sasuke...!!)
雷影『サスケを戻せ！』
Raikage: Return Sasuke!
マダラ『だったらオレの話を聞け　それの返答次第だ』
Madara: Then listen first to what I have to say.
土影『少し落ち着け雷影　聞くだけ聞いてそれからじゃぜ』
Tsuchikage: Calm down a little Raikage, let's just listen.
雷影『チイ…！』
Raikage: Chi...

マダラ、カリンのそばに行き『サスケを回復させておけ…』
Madara goes to Karin's side. Madara: Restore Sasuke...
面がカリンを吸い込む
Karin gets sucked in.

カンクロウ『あれがマダラの能力ってやつか…』
Kankuro: This is Madara's ability huh...
テマリ『時空間忍術だな』
Temari: Space/time ninjutsu huh.

カリン（！？）
Karin (!?)
カリンと、サスケのいる時空間の部屋？は、ブリーチの白いちごが出てくる
形、大きさバラバラの箱が並ぶ部屋。みたいな感じ。
Karin is in some space/time secluded room with Sasuke. Kind of like where the white Ichigo from Bleach comes out. The room is lined by and made up of boxes. That's how it looks.
カリン『…　ここは？』
Karin: ...this place is?

マダラ『さて…　そろそろ聞く気になってくれたか…　諸君』
Madara: Now...It seems like you guys are ready to pay attention...Gentlemen.
ガアラ『なぜ　お前がサスケを手懐けようとする？』
Gaara: Why did have Sasuke do this?
マダラ『”スサノオ”まで開眼する写輪眼は稀だ…　いい眼をストックしておきたくてな
五影との実戦で　さらに瞳力を鍛えさせておきたかった…　ここにサスケを送りこんだのは
オレだ　　五影を弱らせて人質に取ろうとも思っていた…　そこまでは無理だったようだが』
Madara: I wanted to awaken his Sharingan's "Susano'o"... I need to stock up on good eyes. His fight with the 5 Kages and sending him here was like my way of training a pupil. I had thought he could weaken the 5 Kages for me to take hostage but it seems that was overdoing it.
水影『人質？…　一体何のために！？』
Mizukage: Hostage?...What could you possibly want from that!?
マダラ『さっき言った”月の眼計画”を円滑に運ぶためだ』
Madara: Like I said, it's to securely carry on my Eye of the Moon plan.
土影『本当にあの　うちはマダラが生きていたとは驚きじゃが…お前ほどの男がなぜこんな
回りくどいやり方をする？　お前の力ならどんな計画でも思い通りのはずじゃぜ』
Tsuchi kage: For real? It's surprising that Uchiha Madara is still alive but, why then if you're him? Why such a roundabout way of doing things? With your power you should be able to do as you wish.



Soruce: NF
Credit: on3word
Verification: Confirmed

[SIZE=4]Part 3[/SIZE]
マダラ『初代火影桂間との闘いの傷が深すぎたのだ…
今のオレに力はない　言わば今のオレはただの形骸化した存在にしかすぎない』
Madara: My fight with the Shodaime Hokage left me deeply wounded...
シー『お前が…　本来の自分に戻るための計画ってやつか…？』
Shii: You...So is this plan to restore yourself to the way you were...?
マダラ『うむ…そうとも言えるが…　それだけではない』
Madara: Yes...you could say that...but not just that.
ミフネ『何を企む！？　”月の眼計画”とは一体なんだ！？』
Mifune: What are you scheming!? What then is this Eye of the Moon plan!?
マダラ『ゆっくり話したい…　腰を下ろさせてもらう』
Madara: I want to take my time talking about this...so please sit down.

座り込むマダラ。(笑)
Madara sits. (Haha)

カンクロウ『どんな計画かって聞いてんだろうが！』
Kankuro: What kind of plan are you going to share with us?

マダラ、人差し指を無言で立てる
Madara raises his index finger
ガアラ『？』
Gaara: ?

マダラ『全てがオレと一つになる！　全ての統一を成す完全体だ』
Madara: I will become one with everything! I will unify all and obtain the perfect body.

一同『…！？』
Everyone: ...!?
土影『一つになる…？全ての統一じゃと…？どういう事じゃ！？』
Tsuchikage: Become one...? Unify all...? What is this!?
マダラ『うちはには代々伝わる古の石碑がある　今も木の葉のちかにある
そこはかつての六道仙人が書き付けた秘密が記してある
瞳力がなければ読むことができず　　写輪眼・万華鏡写輪眼・輪廻眼の順に
解読できる内容が増える』
Madara: There's a stone monument that has been passed down for generations to the Uchiha. Even now, close to Konoha, the Rikudo Sennin once wrote about a secret there. Unless you have you pupil, you will be unable to read and decipher the Sharingan, Mangekyou Sharingan, Rinnegan as well as increasing it's contents.
土影『話がマユツバものになってきたな　六道仙人など…』
Tsuchikage: This story has become like a fable, with the Rikudo Sennin and all...
マダラ『これは事実だ　彼は存在した　　そしてその石碑を残した』
Madara: This is the truth, he lived. And he left that stone monument.
雷影イライラ～～『話が逸れた！　お前の計画と　その六道仙人と何の関係がある！？』
Raikage: This talk is straying! How does the Rikudo Sennin related to your plan!?
一同『？
Everyone: ?

※ここから長いよ。続きます。
It's long from here. Continuing.

[SIZE=4]Part 4[/SIZE]
マダラ『なぜ彼が伝説となり忍の神のように崇められるようになったのか
知っているか？
そこにオレの目的と　この男（六道仙人）との繋がりがありる』
Madara: How did this legend among shinobi, become revered like a god. Do you know?
水影『…うちはマダラ…　アナタは　万華鏡写輪眼を持ち”暁”には輪廻眼の輩もいた
アナタも全てをしっているのね』
Mizukage: ...Uchiha Madar...you, an Akatsuki weilding the Mangekyou Sharingan, and a companion with the Rinnegan...you must also know of its entirety right.
土影『聞こう』
Tsuchikage: Lets listen.
マダラ『彼はかつて世界をすくった　あるバケモノから…』
Madara: He once created this world, from that monster...
ガアラ『バケモノ…？』
Gaara: Monster...?
マダラ『ガアラ…お前もそのバケモノの一部が封印されていたにすぎない
そいつは尾獣全ての集合体　　…最強のチャクラを持つ存在　　　十尾だ』
Madara: Gaara...a part of that monster was sealed in you. It is the the aggregation of all the biju. The being possessing the greatest chakra, the Jyubi (ten tails).

十尾の絵があるんだけど、眼が一つ。
There's a picture of the Jyubi but it only has 1 eye.
眼が万華鏡写輪眼。
It's eye has the Mangekyou Sharingan.
姿は、九尾に似てる。
The figure/shape is similar to the Kyubi.

ガアラ『！？』
Gaara: !?
テマリ『尾獣は九尾までじゃないのか！？』
Temari: Aren't there only 9 biju!?
マダラ『言ったはずだ…　そいつは尾獣全ての集合体だと
一尾から九尾までの尾獣は　その十尾のチャクラを分散したものにすぎない
六道仙人によってな』
Madara: I said didn't I?...It's a culmination of all the biju. From the Ichibi to the Kyubi, the Jyubi's chakra was dispersed by the Rikudo Sennin.
カンクロウ『イヤな話の流れじゃん…だから”暁”は尾獣を集めていたってことか…』
Kankuro: This story has gone bad...so Akatsuki has been collecting the biju for...
マダラ『六道仙人は十尾から世界を守るため　ある忍術を開発した…
今もその忍術は密かに受け継がれている　人柱力の封印のシステム…
そう六道仙人は…　十尾の人柱力だった　　十尾を抑え込むため
その体に封印したのだ
人々を苦しめていた十尾から世界を救った仙人は人々から神のように崇められた
しかしまりに強大にしてチャクラは己が死ねば封印が解け　また表へ出てきてしまう
それを恐れた六道仙人は死に際に最後の力を使い　十尾のチャクラを九つに分散し
地上の各地へとバラまいた
そして十尾のチャクラを抜かれた本体は封印され力及ばない空へと飛ばされた
それが月となった』
Madara: The Rikudo Sennin protected the world from the Jyubi, and a ninjutsu was developed to to so. The mystery of that ninjutsu has been passed on even today, the system to seal Jinchuriki. That's right, the Rikudo Sennin was the Jinchuriki of the Jyubi. In order to suppress the Jyubi, he sealed it into his own body. The Rikudo Sennin save the world from the Jyubi inflicting pain on the people as was praised like a god. But if he died, the seal would break and would release the Jyubi back into the world. Fearful of that, he used the greatest power and split the Jyubi into 9 parts. They were split and separated across the land. And to make the Jyubi's power unobtainable, he flew into the sky and created the moon.

ダルイ『話がでかすぎる…人間にそんな事が本当にできるのか？』
Darui: This story is too huge...can a human really do this?
マダラ『十尾の人柱力となった六道仙人は　すでに人外の輩になっていた』
Madara: By becoming the Jinchuriki of the Jyubi, the Rikudo Sennin, has already moved beyond us as a peer.
ミフネ『お前がその分散してあった九つのチャクラ…　つまり全ての尾獣を集めて
その人外の力を手にするつもりなのは　わかった　　が…そんな力を手に入れて
何をする？』
Mifune: You...those 9 separate chakras...I understand you intend to collect the biju to obtain this inhuman power but, what do you intend to do with this power?

マダラ『十尾復活！
そしてオレは十尾の人柱力となる　　その力を利用して己の瞳力を強大させ
…そして　あつ術を発動させる』
Madara: Revive the Jyubi! And then as the Jyubi's Jinchuriki, I'll use this power to make my eye stronger, and to activate a jutsu.
土影『ある術じゃと！？　何じゃそれは！？何をするつもりじゃ！？』
Tsuchikage: A jutsu!? What are you talking about!? What is it you intend to do!?

[SIZE=4]Part 5[/SIZE]
マダラ『月に己の眼を投影する大幻術　　　無限月読…
地上に存在する全ての人間に幻術をかける！
アレが全ての人間を　その幻術の中でコントロールし
世界を一つにするのだ！』
Madara: I will project the greatest genjutsu on the moon, Mugen Tsukiyomi (Infinite Tsukiyomi)...All people living on this planet will be put in my genjutsu! I will control everyone with this genjutsu and unify this world.

一同『！！！』
Everyone: !!!

マダラ『わだかまりも争いもない世界だ　全てがオレと一つになる
全ての統一
それがオレの”月の眼計画”』
Madara: A world without ill feeling or strife. Everything will become one with me. Unify all. This is my Eye of the Moon plan.
雷影『ふざけるな！！　お前などに世界は渡さん！！』
Raikage: Stop messing around!! I won't hand over the world to someone like you!!
ガアラ『幻の中の平和などごまかしだ　現実の世界で成しえてこそ意味がある』
水影『そんなものの中に何があるって言うの！　希望も夢もない！逃げているだけよ！』
Gaara: Decieved by a peace only in illusion. There's meaning to (our) actions in the real world.
土影『世界を一つにするか…　確かダンゾウも同じようなことを言っとったが…
お前のは世界を一つにすると言うより　世界を自分一人のものにしたいとしか聞こえん』
Tsuchikage: Unify the world huh...It's true Danzo said the same thing however, you say you want to make the world one, but all I hear is you wanting the world for yourself.
マダラ『ククク…そういう　お前達五影に何ができたと言うのだ？
お前達なら本当は理解しているハズだ…　　　　希望などない事を！！
希望とは　あきらめに等しいものだ…　ごまかしのセリフでしかない
残りの八尾と九尾を差し出し　オレの計画に　もろもろ協力しろ
でなければ戦争になる』
Madara: Kukuku...I see, Do you see what you 5 Kage are doing and saying? You al must certainly understand...that there is no hope! Hope is like giving up...it's just a word to cover up reality. Hand over the remaining Hachibi and Kyubi. If you don't cooperate, this will mean war.
ガアラ『戦争だと…？』
Gaara: War...?
雷影『八尾…？　…どういう事だ！？　ビーはお前達が…！』
Raikage: Hachibi...? ....What do you mean? Don't you guys...!
マダラ『八尾の捕獲は失敗し逃げられた…　あれこそ人柱力として完璧な忍だ…
お前の弟だけある』
Madara: The capture of the Hachibi was a failure and he escaped....As a Jinchuriki, he's a perfect shinobi...despite being your younger brother.

雷影ガーン。。。顎外れそう。(笑)
Raikage is pissed...his facial expression is funny (to Ohana)
ダルイ『ああ…やっぱり…そんな気もしてたんスよね…』
Darui: Ah...as thought...for him to do something like that...
シー『ハア…』
Shii: Ha..
雷影『あのアホーンめ！！これを機に里の外へ出て遊んどるのかアアア！！！
許さん！　鉄の爪（アイアンクロー）じゃ！！』
Raikage: That idiot!! To leave the village and go play!!!!

ガアラ『うずまきなるとは渡さない』
Gaara: I won't hand over Uzumaki Naruto.
水影『私も同じく！』
Mizukage: I won't either!
土影『雷影お前は？』
Tsuchikage: And you Raikage?
雷影『もちろん弟は渡さん！』
Raikage: Of course I won't hand over my younger brother!
マダラ『オレには力はないが…　今までに集めた尾獣がある　お前達に勝ち目はないぞ』
Madara: I don't have any power but...until now I have collected biju and none of you have any chance of winning.
ガアラ『希望は捨てない』
GaaraL I won't abandon hope.


マダラ『いいだろう…　　第四次忍界大戦…　　ここに宣戦を布告する』
Madara: Fine... I proclaim a declaration of the 4th Great Ninja War from here on out.

ついに始まる世界戦争！！
At last, a world war begins!
.

Also, these further clarifications on the spoiler were posted:

Originally Posted by ShounenSuki
Madara: "There's an ancient stone monument passed down through the generations among the Uchiha. Even now, it is near Konoha. On it is written a secret that was once written down by the Sage of the Six Paths. Unless one has an eye power, one cannot read it. The Sharingan, Mangekyou Sharingan, and Rinnegan: in that order, each can decipher more details [than the previous eye power]."

Madara: "This is the truth. He did exist. And he did leave behind that stone monument."

Madara: "He once saved the world. From a certain monster..."

Part 2:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShounenSuki
"That's what I said... It was the aggregation of all the Tailed Beasts. The Tailed Beasts, from the One-Tails to the Nine-Tails, are nothing more than the dispersed chakra of the Ten-Tails. Which was done by the Sage of the Six Paths.

Part 3:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShounenSuki
Madara: "To protect the world from the Ten-Tails, that's why the Sage of the Six Paths developed a certain ninjutsu...
Even now, that ninjutsu is handed down in secrecy; Jinchuuriki sealing system...

So the Sage of the Six Paths was... the jinchuuriki of the Ten-Tails. To stop the Ten-Tails, he sealed its body.
The Sage, having saved the world from the Ten-Tails that tormented the people, was revered by the people as a god.

However, if he were to die, the seal would unravel and that uncommonly powerful chakra would arise once again.
Fearing this, the Sage of the Six Paths used his last power at the time of his death, split the Ten-Tails' chakra into nine and scattered it to various places across the Earth's surface

Then, unable to seal it, he hurled the original body that the Ten-Tails' chakra had been extracted from into the sky.
That became the moon."

Darui: "That tale is far too tall... Can humans really do such a thing?"

Madara: "The sage of the Six Paths, by becoming the jinchuuriki of the Ten-Tails, had already grown beyond his fellow humans

ShounenSuki's opinion / clarification

The spoilers clearly state that the Sage hurled the body of the Ten-Tails into the sky, which then became the moon.
As hinted by Nagato, he must have hurled the body into the sky with his Chibaku Tensei, which explains why the moon looks like the moon

[feelthepein]

So would it be safe to assume that Nagato told Madara the stuff he was unable to read due to not possessing the Rinnegan? That must be why Madara knows that the Rinnegan can read more of the writings than his MS right?

I think I have a way for Konan to be brought back into the story: Since Nagato and her were incredibly close, it would certainly be plausible for Nagato to have told Konan what he read about the Sage of the Six Paths. Konan could then relay this message to Naruto and his allies since Madara did not tell Naruto and co. about these key facts. I'm not sure how this would help Naruto, but it certainly wouldn't hurt.

[Near]

The only thing you broke is the page...

No way am I bothering with that, so you'll have my input when the chapter's up.

[BlackDragonKing]

Originally Posted by Perentie Fan

Again and again people on forums talk like Hashirama beat Madara with ease. I don't see how this can be true.

I mean their battle created a FREAKING VALLEY!!!!! Not to mention Hashirama had a big advantage in being able to render Kyuubi useless to Madara. I suspect it was a very close fight.

The way I see it:

Madara was fighting with his vast ninja skills, perfectly mastered eternal Mangekyo Sharingan, and the Kyuubi under his control.

Harashima fought with his vast ninja skills and the ability to control bijuu, likely creating a tug-of-war with Madara.

The first hokage walked away from the fight just fine after handing Madara his ass so badly Madara STILL hasn't recovered.

Making a freaking valley's not actually that big a deal for the first Hokage. Yamato is nowhere near his level, and he made that mountain and waterfall no problem.

Mind you, I has also partially joking when I said the first could end this in ten minutes, because as far as I'm concerned the 1st Hokage is the Chuck Norris of the naruto 'verse.

[Perentie Fan]

Originally Posted by Near

The only thing you broke is the page...

No way am I bothering with that, so you'll have my input when the chapter's up.

Suit yourself. I know its a big post, albeit a lot of the space is the Japanese writing.

Originally Posted by BlackDragonKing

The way I see it:

Madara was fighting with his vast ninja skills, perfectly mastered eternal Mangekyo Sharingan, and the Kyuubi under his control.

Harashima fought with his vast ninja skills and the ability to control bijuu, likely creating a tug-of-war with Madara.

Don't forget the wood techniques (if you list one bloodline you should list the other) and the possibility that Hashirama may have used bijuu he controlled against Madara as well (depends on if by this time he had given away all the ones he controlled or not).

The first hokage walked away from the fight just fine after handing Madara his ass so badly Madara STILL hasn't recovered.

Except we don't know what condition he was in at the end of the fight. It might have left him out of chakra and half dead for all we know.

It would be interesting to know though how Madara managed to fake his death in a way that even Hashirama himself was certain he was dead. Of course maybe he didn't intend to fake his death and just managed to survive somehow, but it'd still be nice to know.

Making a freaking valley's not actually that big a deal for the first Hokage. Yamato is nowhere near his level, and he made that mountain and waterfall no problem.

Well he nearly collapsed when he had to expand it, and that was still nowhere near the size of the Final Valley. Albeit Yamato readily admitted he was nothing compared to the 1st.

And actually I thought of the valley itself as being the result of both of them firing uber jutsu and Kyuubi chakra blasts about rather than just a technique from Hashirama.

And if Hashirama is the Chuck Norris of Naruto then what does that make the Sage of Six Paths?