Legendary Jujitsu Master, Confiscation, and Granmarg > Thestalos

[flamingdragon]

First off, why does everybody run Legendary Jujitsu Master, I do not believe he is that good.

Second, why does everyone run confiscation, I do not believe it is worth 1000 lifepoints, it should be a sidedeck card at least.

And third, why does everyone run Thestalos over Granmarg, Granmarg is much better.


As typing I just noticed a correlation between those three questions, hand destruction, which I do not believe should be that high a priority....

[BLSoldier109]

Ok the first one, people basically use LJM because it has high def and a decent effect. Its good vs. hydros and gadgets which was really useful early on in the format and they have just stuck in mainstream monarch ever since.

Confiscation when drawn in opening hand in the hands of a good player = win. It sets up the whole game in your favor and gives you tempo. Its a really good card but its not like every deck uses it... so i dont see the logic in the complaint same with LJM above...

If you don't see why thestalos is the best monarch in this format you really need to think about the meta a little more. Combo decks are everywhere and the best way to stop them is to disrupt their hand.

If you dont feel hand control is an important mechanic in this game i feel pitty for you. The field isnt everything as much as we would like it to be. control of the hand usually corrolates to control of the field which wins games.

[Mantracker]

And third, why does everyone run Thestalos over Granmarg, Granmarg is much better.

lololololololol
ok
sure

[Memo333]

I had 2 Legendary Jujitsu Master in my spin bounce deck, but the problemas was opponent will just attack it once...and I hate to trivute it for a monarch...so I just changed them for 2 goe goes and the deck is more aggro.

[Zdawggedy]

All 3 are great control cards for a number of reasons.

Jujitsu Master is capable of stopping most attacks, acting as monster removal(without actually destroying, which is a plus), and makes the opponent draw the monster that was just spun next turn. It keeps field presence pretty well, clears the field, and can create a mini-lock late game.

Confiscation has a cost, but in control decks or combo decks it's an important form of pre-negation. Don't bother with it in most aggro decks. It seems like a 141, but it's uses have a greater range than some think. It enables you to gaze upon the opponent's hand and remove the card that serves the biggest threat. Possible uses of Confiscation include: discarding a D.D. card, a combo piece, Nobleman of Crossout, and the opponent's only source of field presence(especially good when they are packing a monarch).

Thestalos is good in a normal match up, but against combo decks, he effectively shuts down the combo before it can be played. Unlike Zaborg and Mobius, his discard effect is much easier to pull off. Very rarely will an opponent have zero cards in-hand.

Granmarg is versatile, but he pays for it. He has to hit a face-down s/t or a face-down monster. Sometimes, the opponent doesn't have a face-down monster when it's most optimal to summon him, so the s/t destruction is chosen. Unfortunately, the s/t can be chained. The only time you even out in advantage when you destroy a chained s/t with Granmarg is when the selected s/t is Bottomless Trap Hole or a summons negator. Most of the time, the monarch player is better off running Zaborg or Mobius over Granmarg.

[flamingdragon]

If you dont feel hand control is an important mechanic in this game i feel pitty for you. The field isnt everything as much as we would like it to be. control of the hand usually corrolates to control of the field which wins games.

Hand control is important, but field control is more important.


Jujitsu Master is capable of stopping most attacks, acting as monster removal(without actually destroying, which is a plus), and makes the opponent draw the monster that was just spun next turn. It keeps field presence pretty well, clears the field, and can create a mini-lock late game.


True, but there are better cards worth using instead.

Granmarg is versatile, but he pays for it. He has to hit a face-down s/t or a face-down monster. Sometimes, the opponent doesn't have a face-down monster when it's most optimal to summon him, so the s/t destruction is chosen. Unfortunately, the s/t can be chained. The only time you even out in advantage when you destroy a chained s/t with Granmarg is when the selected s/t is Bottomless Trap Hole or a summons negator. Most of the time, the monarch player is better off running Zaborg or Mobius over Granmarg.

Mobius is often chained as well and the opponent has a face down card on their field most of the time, thestalos can destroy an opponents combo, but its just as likely that you discard something worthless, granmarg can be summoned, destroy a face down monster, and then still attack.

[sslordmagus]

Quick answer:

Removing the treath from hand is safer than removing it from the field.

[Zdawggedy]

True, but there are better cards worth using [than Legendary Jujitsu Master] instead.

In monarch decks, Jujitsu is used as a 'second' GK Spy. His function is to be a set that survives until your next turn. The spin effect is a bonus. He's like a reactive Cyber Dragon(both provide tribute fodder. Cydra can take down another monster first; Jujitsu can spin a monster first).

Mobius is often chained as well and the opponent has a face down card on their field most of the time, thestalos can destroy an opponents combo, but its just as likely that you discard something worthless, granmarg can be summoned, destroy a face down monster, and then still attack.

The option of destroying 1 face-down s/t upon summon is pretty horrible, as is 1 face-down monster. The option of either/or makes Granmarg versatile, though, but like I've said, you pay the price for it. You get a watered down version of Mobius and Zaborg, who are usually better options than Granmarg. I'm not saying you can't run any Granmargs, but the other options available are better. Not many decks play face-down monsters too frequently, leaving you with a weaker Mobius most of the time. If you want versatility, then Raiza is better than Granmarg anyway. Raiza doesn't destroy the card, so Sangan, Sand Moth, etc. don't get their effects, and the card is returned to the top of the deck. The spun card probably won't deal with Raiza anyway, meaning they're draw won't help them change the game state in their favor. The only cards you don't want to spin are monsters like the D.D. family, of which Granmarg would be a worse option in comparison to use anyway.

[SkullBuster]

Quick answer:

Removing the treath from hand is safer than removing it from the field.

I agree.
Doesn't it hurt when even just ONE card is discarded from your hand?
Most decks are now formulated so that EVERY card REALLY counts...

Oh, sslordmagnus, QC as in Quezon City? PM me... >_<

[Jinzo1985]

A first turn Confiscation by a "Good Player" can be devastating if not game winning. And screwing ur opponents draw is almost always benficial with Jujitsu. As for Thestalos, he's the most reliable in terms of playability short of DW....

[blastedmagician]

with all this hand destruction, how come darkworld is not tier one?

[turkeyspit]

First off, why does everybody run Legendary Jujitsu Master, I do not believe he is that good.

You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to be right. I've met people who think Spirit Reaper is crap, Mobius is for n00bs, and Exiled Force is a 'bad card'. Mmmm yeah.

LJM is really good because it serves as a wall to your opponent. Even if it's face-up, your opponent will have to think twice before stomping it. Treeborn Frog does make LJM somewhat less effective I'll admit, but it's murderous against many other cards.

Decks like Doomize and Six Samurai have made LJM somewhat obsolete, but it was really good at the start of the format.


Second, why does everyone run confiscation, I do not believe it is worth 1000 lifepoints, it should be a sidedeck card at least.

Who is this everyone of which you speak? Not everyone runs Confi. I myself will be running it in my newest deck, but I haven't ever ran it consistently.

Confi is good right now because of the prevalance of Combo decks. Imagine paying 1000 LPs to rob your opponent of the 1 copy of Demise in his hand, leaving him stuck with a pair ARA's or Sonic Birds. Or, how about taking their Nobleman of Crossout so you can safely set your Morphing Jar.

Knowing what's in your opponent's hand can be outright devastating, especially early game.


And third, why does everyone run Thestalos over Granmarg, Granmarg is much better.

I'll admit that Granmarg was better at the beginning of this format then it has ever been, simply because 3x GK Spies and 3x LJMs were commonplace. But Thestalos will almost ALWAYS be more effective then Granmarg, as it almost always guarantees that you are generating advantage. Summoning Granmarg to nuke your opponent's face-down Bottomless Trap Hole, Call of the Haunted, Sangan, Treeborn or Card Trooper is less then useful, while the worst that Thestalos can do is turn a Treeborn, Night Assaialant, or maybe a D-Hero Malicious from your opponent's hand.


As typing I just noticed a correlation between those three questions, hand destruction, which I do not believe should be that high a priority....

You would be wrong then. The 3 top tier decks of this format all revolve around combos, which normally implies hoarding your cards until you have all the pieces.

- Doomize
- DDT
- Six Samurai

and the forthcoming

- Norelas / Enrise
- Crystal Beast

all benefit from holding onto cards until the circumstances are right. Tributing off a floater for Thestalos, and knocking that ARA, Destiny Draw, Grandmaster of the Six Samurai, Dimension Fusion, or Rare Value out your opponent's hand FOR FREE, is just to good to pass up.

In a pure Aggro style meta, Hand Control is inferior to field control. That is why early on, you say Mobius and Zaborgs everywhere. Now that people are digging for specific cards to pull off their win conditions, Hand Control is more important than ever.