Character Vs. thread

[orange peel]

This threads on speculations of characters who haven't fought yet in the actual Naruto Timeline and who do you think would win if they actually fought. Try to keep the fighters equal i nlevel (For example, no Itachi V. Choji or any of that) There might be Spoilers.

I'll start it off with Lee Versus Neji.

I believe Lee would win because Neji couldn't keep up with his speed. Although Neji has the Byakugen for close-range, if Lee use the Shadow Leaf Technique again, Neji wouldn't be able to keep up even if he didn't have that Byakugen blind spot. Even Gaara's Sand Shield couldn't keep up. Its like Neji can see the attack but isn't fast enough to react. And Neji could pull off a Shadow Clone like Gaara but I haven't seen him used many Jutsus. What's your opinion?

Additional Comment: BTW, we've been having soem confusion on WHERE in the Naruto Timeline we're talking about. Please specify if you mean in Naruto 1 or 2. Thanks.

[Darth Payne]

Uhhh......Neji often/always beats Lee.

Anyways....Kakashi versus Gai in a real battle would be great to see.

[orange peel]

With the Sharingan, Kakashi'd win. But the scores just about tied up anyways.

[Near]

Kakashi would pretty much win.. and Neji too..

[orange peel]

Not much reasoning going on about who will win and why...And lots of Views but not many posts...

I'm thinking its because we haven't found a good match yet.

Itachi V. Kisame?

[`Phenom]

Not much reasoning going on about who will win and why...And lots of Views but not many posts...

I'm thinking its because we haven't found a good match yet.

Itachi V. Kisame?
Lee vs Neji> Neji Wins
Itachi vs Kisame> Itachi wins

[orange peel]

I'd really like people to go into detail about why whoever the think should win should win.

I'm still trying to find a good example. If they're pwoers are almost exactly even, then, I'm hoping to see people break out in comments and reasons.

Something like this but more:

I believe Lee would win because Neji couldn't keep up with his speed. Although Neji has the Byakugen for close-range, if Lee use the Shadow Leaf Technique again, Neji wouldn't be able to keep up even if he didn't have that Byakugen blind spot. Even Gaara's Sand Shield couldn't keep up. Its like Neji can see the attack but isn't fast enough to react. And Neji could pull off a Shadow Clone like Gaara but I haven't seen him used many Jutsus.

OK, lemme try again. Kabuto V. Kakashi.

Orochimaru stated they're just about even. I believe Kabuto might when because of his wide knowledge of the human body. Which gives him over 100 ways to attack. But then again, Kakashi is well over an experienced veteran and has fought dozens upon dozens of foes.

[Rakath]

Um... explain how Sharingan = Win for Kakashi.

Gai's fighting style is based in physical combat and he's studied to fight specifically to avoid the Sharingan's powers. It isn't so clear cut if you take everything into account. If they are fighting to the death (this allows Kakashi to use Raikiri, and Gai to open gates) Gai has the superior speed and strength. If they are training and it's a friendly spar, Gai is already stronger and faster.

Which brings the question of victory to three things:

1. Location - In an open field, Gai has MUCH better odds. While in a forest, Kakashi has more breathing room and plotting time.
2. Equipment choices - If they are in a friendly combat, both are unarmed, meaning Gai again has an advantage. With a 'fight to the death' Kakashi is more likely to pull out the heavy weaponry and go for killing strikes with anything he can (Kunai, Puppies, etc).
3. Event - Kakashi wins at Rock, Paper, Scissors. Gai wins in direct challenges of physical might.

Kabuto vs. Kakashi

See, the reason Gai stands a chance against Kakashi is he isn't relying on tricks, but pure speed and power. Kabuto needs Ninjutsu to work his way through. Kakashi can (and will) use the Sharingan to get an edge. Unlike Gai vs. Kakashi, this isn't a match of a sword vs. a boulder, this is two swords battling. And as Asuma-sensei stated in the manga, with two tools of the same power, the sharper tool wins. Kakashi is the sharper tool.

Lemme throw one into the mix:

Shikamaru vs. Kabuto

[Akatsuki]

Nice, Rakath, congrats for being a new mod. Anyways, I think that if Asuma and Gai went off in a fight, probably Gai would win, because Asuma has speed, but doesn't have power. However, Gai does have power and speed to help him.

[LostSeraph]

For Shikamaru vs. Kabuto, Shikamaru wins. Both of them are pretty intelligent, tactical fighters but Shikamaru is smarter than Kabuto (200 IQ, anyone?) Kabuto has so far only been seen using medical jutsu and Genjutsu, while Shikamaru uses a variety of tactics depending on the situation, giving him the advantage of versatility. Although Kabuto could be on Kakashi's level, I don't think his medical jutsu and Genjutsu would work too well on Shikamaru.

For Asuma vs. Gai, I think Asuma stands a chance, considering we haven't seen him in combat much. His knuckle busters are a good counter to Gai's Taijutsu, and they are very deadly when combined with Wind chakra. We'll have to see Asuma in an actual fight to determine this one.

Next: Kakashi vs. Sasuke (season 2). I'll say Kakashi wins, mainly because he is a more seasoned fighter and has the Mangekyou Sharingan compared to Sasuke's normal Sharingan.

[orange peel]

At least we're seeing some progress.

But Kakashi's Sharingan will let him evade most of Kabuto's attacks. Kabuto's not really the fast type anyways.

[Frodo420]

Yondaime(4th hokage) vs. Sandaime(3rd hokage). I wonder who would win this one. I'm guessing It'd be close but Yondaime would come out on top cause he seems to be the one everyone admires the most. Yondaime also came up with a lot of his own Jutsu, so he'd probably have the advantage.

[orange peel]

It really would be close. But the 3rd is getting old. And his inability to contain the Nine Tails himself proves that the 4th "Yellow flash" is stronger. IMO. We really need more talk.

[Darth Payne]

The 3rd doesn't even match the 4th. He can't even beat Orochimaru. The 4th is said to be the greatest ninja EVER.

[orange peel]

The 3rd COULD beat Orochimaru. He was old. He was too tender to fight his aprentice fully. AND he had two more Hokages on him too. Plus, he sealed off Orochimaru's hands.

[Alley Cat]

Just so we don't get this thread stuck...

How about Deidara vs Sasori?

Sasori has puppets and bad-ass scorpion form, and Deidara has clay manipultion and bombs.

It's a hard decision, but I'm thinking Sasori.

[Darth Payne]

Deidara has even said Sasori is stronger.

[Alley Cat]

True that. So yeah, Sasori FTW.

How about Shikamaru vs Kakashi?

I don't even have an opinion for that one. o___O

[orange peel]

Duh...Shikamaru will win by far. Obvious One.

[Alley Cat]

How so?

Kakashi's the copycat ninja, and he's pretty alert. Not to mention he can see every move.

Can you explain that victory to me?

[orange peel]

I put the "Duh..." In front for a reason. Even put in "Obvious one" for the slow ones.

[Alley Cat]

Well excuse me if I'm not as educated as you would like me to be.

I asked a simple question because I wanted an explanation. I didn't want to be accused of being "slow", thank you very much.

[orange peel]

...

Uh...Sorry?


OK. How about Gaara V. Lee Again? Or Orochimaru V. Kabuto and That Bone Guy

[Alley Cat]

Can you please just explain how Shika would win?

I'm curious now.

[orange peel]

I was being sarcastic. Kakashi would win by far.

[Alley Cat]

Thought so.

I was gonna say "How the heck would Shika win with Kakashi's eye and Jounin-ness?"

And as for Gaara vs Rock Lee, I still think Gaara would win. Lee nearly got killed before, and if Gai hadn't of stepped in, he very well could've died.

[orange peel]

But they've both progressed. Maybe with Rock Lee's Drunken Fist...

[nosniv hsav]

...

Uh...Sorry?


OK. How about Gaara V. Lee Again? Or Orochimaru V. Kabuto and That Bone Guy

Orochimaru vs Kimimaro(bone guy) & Kabuto= Orochimaru wins guy.

Reason guy:
Orochimaru: Hey...Stop that guy.
Kabuto guy: Ok boss guy.
Kimimaro guy: Ok*Heart Explodes*.......guy

[Alley Cat]

XDDD Possibly, Orangepeel.

Intoxicated Rock Lee FTW!

They should have that for a card in the TCG, I swear.

[Rakath]

Shikamaru vs. Kakashi is a battle of time. If we start at midnight or noon, Kakashi would have an edge beginning, but Shikamaru just has to last till dawn/dusk and Kakashi would be too tired, while Shikamaru has full range.

To reverse that, if the fight starts at dawn, both are weakening as time moves on. Kakashi would win because Shikamaru cannot default to the 'wait and see' strategy which would win it.

Drunken Lee is a card in japanese, he gets a 'sake token' on him, on your turns Sake Tokens are +1/+1 and on their turns is a -1/-1.

[orange peel]

He's smarter than Shikamaru...He has a better sense of smell than Kiba...He has better Sharingan than Sasuke...and better Taijutsu than Thick Brows...

I think Kakashi would have wiped out Shikimaru before Dawn. He can't keep up with Sharingan for that long.

[torchamp]

Shikamaru vs. Kakashi is a battle of time. If we start at midnight or noon, Kakashi would have an edge beginning, but Shikamaru just has to last till dawn/dusk and Kakashi would be too tired, while Shikamaru has full range.

To reverse that, if the fight starts at dawn, both are weakening as time moves on. Kakashi would win because Shikamaru cannot default to the 'wait and see' strategy which would win it.

Drunken Lee is a card in japanese, he gets a 'sake token' on him, on your turns Sake Tokens are +1/+1 and on their turns is a -1/-1.

i higly doubt the fight would last this ong. Ino and sakura's fight was considered long despite the fact that it was stated that it only took about 15 minutes. The longest fight we've ever really seen is the zabuza and haku fights and in those it was because haku was stalling and zabuza and kakashi were so even. i reaaly don't think any ninja fight would last more than an hour, and i see that as a stretch.

[flame controler]

i think lee would beat neji big time
during the chuunin selection exams, lee was definitly stronger.

the only thing neji has got vs lee's awesome speed is kaiten...

JUST kaiten...

neji is just not fast enough.

[orange peel]

Well, it depends on how old they are. In Naruto 2, they've both progressed tremendously and have both gotten new Jutsus. Neji's Byakugen is completely different from Sharingan but it still might give him an advantage. But Lee's superior speed would wi nthe match.

[Rakath]

i higly doubt the fight would last this ong. Ino and sakura's fight was considered long despite the fact that it was stated that it only took about 15 minutes. The longest fight we've ever really seen is the zabuza and haku fights and in those it was because haku was stalling and zabuza and kakashi were so even. i reaaly don't think any ninja fight would last more than an hour, and i see that as a stretch.

Oh, don't underestimate Shikamaru ability to bide his time. If the battle started at noon, Shikamaru would hide, and Kakashi would chase. Shikamaru would keep the cat and mouse game going. Kakashi would be put in one of two situations:

1. Drop the Sharingan use, fear of chakra depletion. This allows Shikamaru an opening to strike.
2. Keep the Sharingan out, fear of Shikamaru sneak attack. This causes him to just keep draining.

Shikamaru would wait for the sun to begin setting before coming out of hiding. Remember what his strategy was with Temari?

[orange peel]

Kakashi's smarter and faster than Shikimaru. He would catch him.

[maur]

with the shikimaru vs. kakashi, it depends on the battlefield. in a forest or any place with plenty of shadows kakashi would be captured quickly. in a plain or wide open area kakashi would be able to dodge the shadow long enough to beat shikimaru.

of course this doesn't matter since shikimaru is only allowed to fight females :P

[Rakath]

Kakashi's smarter and faster than Shikimaru. He would catch him.

Nobody is smarter than Shikamaru, this is one of those things that is shown over and over in the series. Shikamaru would of done the 'early are Chunin' thing like Kakashi, Itachi, and the others, but he's REALLY lazy.

Shikamaru can fight guys... not one on one. Kakashi has to have help or Shikamaru needs to have help, otherwise Shikamaru will just avoid the whole fight entirely.

[orange peel]

Kakashi's had much more experience in fighting and Jutsus to beat Shikimaru. If one of the Sound four can finish off Shika, then so can Kakashi.

Hey...I just notice I have a Kakashi avatar and you have a Shikimaru avatar...

[Rakath]

None of the Sound 4 finished off Shikamaru, proven by Shikamaru's injuries after that fight being a broken pinky and nothing else.

Yeah, I know, he was in for a world of hurt soon, but he still came out of the whole Sound Arc with the least number of injuries for anyone there.

And Kakashi's had more experience, this means that both of them would know exactly how the other fights, chances are since both are really laid back, they would settle it with a game of Go or Shogi. (In the case of Go we have a tie in with Hikaru no Go now).

[torchamp]

None of the Sound 4 finished off Shikamaru, proven by Shikamaru's injuries after that fight being a broken pinky and nothing else.

Yeah, I know, he was in for a world of hurt soon, but he still came out of the whole Sound Arc with the least number of injuries for anyone there.

And Kakashi's had more experience, this means that both of them would know exactly how the other fights, chances are since both are really laid back, they would settle it with a game of Go or Shogi. (In the case of Go we have a tie in with Hikaru no Go now).

he only escaped mostly unscathed beacuse of temari's intervention. The sound four weren't that strong, they were all at mid level chuunin levels. Kakashi, who is one of, if not THE village's strongest jounin would very quickly catch up to shikamaru. If he was really afraid of a sneak attack he could create bunshins and pursue shikamaru with those until shika ran out of chakra from ensnaring the clones with his jutsu, kakashi could thn move in (i know the amount of chakra to create this many bunshins is vast, but i'm willing to bet that shika has less chakra than kakashi)

also, a simple fire opr wind jutsu could take care of that forest you were talking about, he's bound to have copied one.

[Akatsuki]

I was really wondering, Itachi said himself, Jiraya is stronger than himself and other members of the Akatsuki, yet, Orichimaru left the Akatsuki most likely because he was scared of Itachi. However, Orichimaru is more powerful than Jiraya? Is there something unique between those characters?

[Green Koolaid]

Here is one for you:
If Jiraiya has trouble with Naruto and Orochimaru has trouble with Sasuke then Wouldnt Tsunade have trouble with sakura? That would be a cool fight.

Eventually these kids will become to much for them to handle.

Here are a few more:
Akumaru vs the pug ninja
Jiraiya vs naruto vs ebisu(in perverted-ness)
sasori's puppets vs sesame street
Sai vs. sasuke(who is more emo?)

[Blast Hornet]

I wanna see Naruto vs Sasuke (after the time skip). I think that that match would be a ton better than the one when Naruto first tried to apprehend Sasuke.

Also, I want to see a Gaara vs. Neji match, too.

[torchamp]

I was really wondering, Itachi said himself, Jiraya is stronger than himself and other members of the Akatsuki, yet, Orichimaru left the Akatsuki most likely because he was scared of Itachi. However, Orichimaru is more powerful than Jiraya? Is there something unique between those characters?

in simple terms (using the manga and simple logic):

jiraiya>itachi and akatsuki (leader is probably stronger then jiraiya, otherwise there'd be no point since jiraiya could step in and kill him)>orochimaru

jiraiya is stated by itachi to be stronger than itachi, orochimaru says that even combined, he and sasuke have no chance of beating itachi. So by using the transitive property (if a>b and b>c then a>c) jiraiya is stronger then orochimaru and itachi

[orange peel]

I was really wondering, Itachi said himself, Jiraya is stronger than himself and other members of the Akatsuki, yet, Orichimaru left the Akatsuki most likely because he was scared of Itachi. However, Orichimaru is more powerful than Jiraya? Is there something unique between those characters?

I'd launch right into all the good Vs. Stuff I have no time to read. But I have no time ATM. I will reply to this and THEN launch into the VS Talk when I have time. Which would be in a 1 or 2 days.

We don't really know why Orochimaru left. But some speculate he thought Itachi was too strong a container. The Akatsuki ring still lies with his former body's distorted finger. No idea why he didn't keep it. We don't really know the Akatsuki's true goals, but doue to recent reading, I've discovered each Akatsuki aims for a Biju. There were initially 10 members (One for each finger), so this might prove false. AND Itachi seems to want Suzaku if there is one. Perhaps Oro thought Itach itoo strong a container to take over or he knew about Suzaku (If this theory holds up) and wants to go for Sasuke instead because (SPOILERS...kinda.) he has Suzaku hidden in him PLUS he's a power "Potentially stronger than Itachi" with the Sharingan and has "ability to awaken the Mangekyou Sharingan". So if Oro takes Sasuke, he will take Suzaku AND a stronger body with one move. Kinda like killing two birds with one kunai. And Suzaku SEEMS related to the Bijus so it might make up for the 10th one.

Kinda went a little overboard. Carry on. Reply to this if you want.

[Akatsuki]

No. Orichimaru is NOT weaker than Jiraya, as the Legendary Sennin work like Scissors, Papers, Rock. Jiraya is the scissors, beating Tsunade, the paper, and Tsunade beats Orichimaru (Rock). Then, Orichimaru wins Jiraya (Scissors).

[torchamp]

No. Orichimaru is NOT weaker than Jiraya, as the Legendary Sennin work like Scissors, Papers, Rock. Jiraya is the scissors, beating Tsunade, the paper, and Tsunade beats Orichimaru (Rock). Then, Orichimaru wins Jiraya (Scissors).

dude, transative property. Anyway, i know they are rock paper scissors and all that but tsunade is obviously weaker than orochimaru, thus breaking the chain. It's not supposed to be taken literally.

[Akatsuki]

Okay. I guess your right. But still, I'm not really sure with Jiraya beating Orichimaru. It's kind of hard to do that. Very few, if no one, has beaten Orichimaru.

[Darth Payne]

Jiraiya>Itachi>Orochimaru

[Green Koolaid]

Naruto>Jiraiya..........eventually

[Rakath]

dude, transative property. Anyway, i know they are rock paper scissors and all that but tsunade is obviously weaker than orochimaru, thus breaking the chain. It's not supposed to be taken literally.

I'm not quite sure how anyone can say Tsunade is weaker than anyone without being struck by lightning... considering she could WEILD BOSS FROG'S DAGGER!

Orochimaru couldn't beat Tsunade, all he could do was run away very very fast.

[torchamp]

Naruto>Jiraiya..........eventually

naruto>everyone
eventually

Additional Comment:
I'm not quite sure how anyone can say Tsunade is weaker than anyone without being struck by lightning... considering she could WEILD BOSS FROG'S DAGGER!

Orochimaru couldn't beat Tsunade, all he could do was run away very very fast.

tsunade has no ranged jutsus, as longas orochimaru stayed out of her arm's length, he's golden. He'd just keep goin with the sword or long range jutsus until tsunade ran out of chakra to keep healing herself, then he could move in for the kill

[orange peel]

What Timeline are you guys going on about? Seems like everyone's a bit confused.

Why don't we state that?

The Three Legendary Ninjas (I go by my translation :p) HAVE faced off in Naruto 1. I won't go too far into that because most people here seems to be talking about Naruto 2. But Kabuto, at the time, was evenly matched with Tsunade, if not stronger, and Orochimaru is no doubt stronger than Kabuto AT THE TIME. I'm saying strongness in skill, not force, which Tsunade would crush all competition in, followed closely by Sakura (in Naruto 2).

I need to know when you're talking about before I can go.

[Darth Payne]

Ummm....Kabuto's not even close to Tsunade. He just seemed like it.

Tsunade's a legendary, S-Rank Hokage. She's way above some Jonin level medic.

[Akatsuki]

Ummm....Kabuto's not even close to Tsunade. He just seemed like it.

Tsunade's a legendary, S-Rank Hokage. She's way above some Jonin level medic. Actually, Kabuto does not have a known rank, so it's hard to say.

[Green Koolaid]

Tsunade is physically the strongest of the 3 senin. Jiraiya said she beat him almost to the point of death for "sneakin a peek."

[orange peel]

Tsunade is physically the strongest of the 3 senin. Jiraiya said she beat him almost to the point of death for "sneakin a peek."

Actually, they got into a fight when they were doing the bells test. Jiraiya was tied to a tree for trying to steal the food and Tsunade teased him so he called her "flat-chested". And since he was tied up, he couldn't avoid the blows.

Sakura's power is just as strong as Tsunade in Naruto 2. Her chakra control is very precise. Both of them can shatter the ground and create large craters simply by punching it.

But it usually won't do any damage unless it hits someone. Which Tsunade never did in her fight. Because Kabuto avoided all of her blows and almost managed to cripple/paralyze her but her breasts cushioned the impact of the paralyzation. (Naruto 1) Orochimaru was watching from the distance and didn't bother fighting Tsunade and sent Kabuto to do it because he knew it was an easy win for him. And he needed Tsunade's help back then. They did, however, fight a bit when Jiriaya stepped in. Tsunade went down before Jiraiya or Orochimaru did though.

BTW, Tsunade summons slugs?

And things might have changed in the Time Skip.

[Darth Payne]

Actually, Kabuto does not have a known rank, so it's hard to say.
It's technically Genin, but his power is about the same as Kakashi's, who is a very high Jonin.

[orange peel]

It's technically Genin, but his power is about the same as Kakashi's, who is a very high Jonin.

Which is Orochimaru's estimate.

[Darth Payne]

Which is Orochimaru's estimate.
It's not like he'd be really wrong about that. =/

[Akatsuki]

It's not like he'd be really wrong about that. =/ Who knows? Not much is known about Kabuto, except he was found on a battlefield, became a medical nin, is really smart, perform high level genjutsu, and is as strong as Kakashi.

[orange peel]

Who knows? Not much is known about Kabuto, except he was found on a battlefield, became a medical nin, is really smart, perform high level genjutsu, and is as strong as Kakashi.

Last bit is Orochimaru's estimate. And that was all in Naruto 1.

They all train and change in Naruto 2.

[Near]

Tsunade just had some phobies, especially that blood phobie, but in a 1vs1 legit battle, I'm pretty sure Tsunade would beat Kabuto.

[orange peel]

You mean phobia?

Perhaps. I don't think she got over it though. And to a ninja, everything is a weakness.

[Near]

You mean phobia?

Perhaps. I don't think she got over it though. And to a ninja, everything is a weakness.
I wildly guesses that Phobia is plural is Phobies, and accidentaly used phobie instead of Phobia.

Didn't you notice her crazy blood phobia?

[Justmcnew]

I think that down the road, Itachi goes against Orochimaru and owns him, afterall Itachi was the reason why Orochimaru left the Akatsuki Org.

[orange peel]

I wildly guesses that Phobia is plural is Phobies, and accidentaly used phobie instead of Phobia.

Didn't you notice her crazy blood phobia?

I think the plurals Phobias. And its ironic how she's a Medical Ninja and is scared of a single drop of blood.

[Akatsuki]

I think the plurals Phobias. And its ironic how she's a Medical Ninja and is scared of a single drop of blood.Yeah. It's kind of interesting though. Everyone has a weakness. I wonder what Itachi's weakness is?

[LostSeraph]

Yeah. It's kind of interesting though. Everyone has a weakness. I wonder what Itachi's weakness is?
This may sound strange, but I think it's his eyes. Remember Kakashi saying that they deteriorated? I think using Mangekyou Sharingan too much may eventually cause him to go blind or something, due to the strain on his eyes.

Anyway, let's get back on topic: Kabuto vs. Sakura. I think we can assume this will be a very long battle, what with both ninjas able to heal themselves. Kabuto will probably win if the battle becomes drawn out since he most likely has more chakra than Sakura, although Sakura could knock him out/kill him with a few well-aimed punches.

[Blast Hornet]

Another match I'd like to see would be my boy Gaara vs. Neji. The battle of Ultimate defenses would be great to see, IMO.

[orange peel]

This may sound strange, but I think it's his eyes. Remember Kakashi saying that they deteriorated? I think using Mangekyou Sharingan too much may eventually cause him to go blind or something, due to the strain on his eyes.

Anyway, let's get back on topic: Kabuto vs. Sakura. I think we can assume this will be a very long battle, what with both ninjas able to heal themselves. Kabuto will probably win if the battle becomes drawn out since he most likely has more chakra than Sakura, although Sakura could knock him out/kill him with a few well-aimed punches.

Or Itachi would need to wear glasses, LMAO. But it'd certainly be a suprise if he went blind.

And for Sakura v. Kabuto, I'd think Kabuto would win. Sakura might have more power and knowledge. But experience wins the day. Plus Kabuto is a genius.

[torchamp]

Or Itachi would need to wear glasses, LMAO. But it'd certainly be a suprise if he went blind.

And for Sakura v. Kabuto, I'd think Kabuto would win. Sakura might have more power and knowledge. But experience wins the day. Plus Kabuto is a genius.

plus i don't think that sakura is at the high jonin level that kakshi is at. I'd put her at about asuma's or kurenai's level.

[Rakath]

Not to mention Kabuto constantly regenerates naturally, without an overuse of chakra like others.

And those glasses are awesome.

[Darth Payne]

plus i don't think that sakura is at the high jonin level that kakshi is at. I'd put her at about asuma's or kurenai's level.
Not even that high. She's only Chunin, though being a medic does make her more valuable than the average Chunin, she's nowhere near Jonin.

[Akatsuki]

Not even that high. She's only Chunin, though being a medic does make her more valuable than the average Chunin, she's nowhere near Jonin.Yeah, Sakura couldn't compete with Kabuto when using genjutsu, or even healing. If Sakura gets 1 or 2 major power hits in, I doubt much would happen, because Kabuto would just heal. Wait, Itachi uses his eyes, so why is it a disadvantage for him? I think that he just gets tired from using it constantly, and can only use Tsukyomi/Ameratsu only once per day before his eyes wear out.

[orange peel]

Yeah, Sakura couldn't compete with Kabuto when using genjutsu, or even healing. If Sakura gets 1 or 2 major power hits in, I doubt much would happen, because Kabuto would just heal. Wait, Itachi uses his eyes, so why is it a disadvantage for him? I think that he just gets tired from using it constantly, and can only use Tsukyomi/Ameratsu only once per day before his eyes wear out.

Eyes deteriorate permanently overtime. (Not for normal Sharingan)

If it was a medical contest and they had to cure a person with a disease. I'd think Sakura would win. But Kabuto does have really good on the field self-healing Jutsus so he'd probably win if they fought.

[grim mouser]

Itachi vs. Naruto in 2... LOL I dunno if it's happened yet. ;P

[LostSeraph]

Actually, it did happen. The only thing was that he wasn't really fighting Itachi, but another person who had 30% of Itachi's power. On that occasion, Naruto beat Itachi with Odama Rasengan.

[Darth Payne]

If it was a medical contest and they had to cure a person with a disease. I'd think Sakura would win.What makes you say that?

[Rakath]

Well, she did do that whole 'make a cure for that impossible to cure poison even by the standards of the guy that made the poison' thing...

[torchamp]

Well, she did do that whole 'make a cure for that impossible to cure poison even by the standards of the guy that made the poison' thing...

he probably thought it was imposible to cure cause no one in sungaraku could cure it, not cause it was uncurable period.

[Akatsuki]

Nah, I doubt Sakura would be better than Kabuto at healing, even though she was trained by Tsunade. Kabuto was also trained to be a medical ninja too.

[grim mouser]

Atasuki (meh, I know incorrect spelling, I'll fix it) leader vs. Kakashi and Jiraiya... LOL.

[Akatsuki]

Probably the leader. Not much is known though, so I guess we'll have to wait. Or maybe, All Legendary Sannin VS. Leader?

[LostSeraph]

Akatsuki leader wins, of course. If even Itachi is willing to work for him, he must be one of, if not the strongest ninja alive.

[Akatsuki]

Then hopefully, Naruto or someone will beat the Akatsuki Leader eventually. Otherwise the story will have no point, and should just be called Akatsuki.

[Hemostrat]

God I hate that. The spotlight goes on one character besides Naruto and everyone jumps on the "Why isn't the show called ____" band wagon. Same thing happened with Sasuke, Asuma, Shikamaru. You don't have a good story if you only develope one person, and one person only. :rolleyes:

Anyway, Kabuto would own Sakura. Why? He's a much better healer. He said "Orochimaru-sama chose me because of my healing skills" or something like that when he was fighting Tsunade I believe. Like hell Sakura would get that good in three years.

Kakashi would get owned by the leader. Why? He got owned by Itachi. Itachi is the leader's ***** basically. "Go out and get the Kyuubi" "Right away". Hidan and Kakuzu stopped fighting right away, though neither of them wanted to because the leader ordered them to. Jiraya can't beat the leader either. He can't beat Oro, who can't beat Itachi, who can't beat the leader. A < B, B < C therfore A < C.

And I highly doubt the two of them together could beat him as well.

[Darth Payne]

Jiraiya's the most powerful chracter in the show right now, and the Leader might actually be really weak, it's just everyone follows him because he has a killer plan only he can carry out.

[PURE Guts]

Naruto on steroid 9 tails cakra all out vs Kakashi full out :D

i would like to see him copy that LMAO he would run out of cakra first blink...

[torchamp]

God I hate that. The spotlight goes on one character besides Naruto and everyone jumps on the "Why isn't the show called ____" band wagon. Same thing happened with Sasuke, Asuma, Shikamaru. You don't have a good story if you only develope one person, and one person only. :rolleyes:

Anyway, Kabuto would own Sakura. Why? He's a much better healer. He said "Orochimaru-sama chose me because of my healing skills" or something like that when he was fighting Tsunade I believe. Like hell Sakura would get that good in three years.

Kakashi would get owned by the leader. Why? He got owned by Itachi. Itachi is the leader's ***** basically. "Go out and get the Kyuubi" "Right away". Hidan and Kakuzu stopped fighting right away, though neither of them wanted to because the leader ordered them to. Jiraya can't beat the leader either. He can't beat Oro, who can't beat Itachi, who can't beat the leader. A < B, B < C therfore A < C.

And I highly doubt the two of them together could beat him as well.

sigh,

in simple terms (using the manga and simple logic):

jiraiya>itachi and akatsuki (leader is probably stronger then jiraiya, otherwise there'd be no point since jiraiya could step in and kill him)>orochimaru

jiraiya is stated by itachi to be stronger than itachi, orochimaru says that even combined, he and sasuke have no chance of beating itachi. So by using the transitive property (if a>b and b>c then a>c) jiraiya is stronger then orochimaru and itachi

me responding to uchiha itachi making the saame claim two pages ago. I just love how evryone assumes that oro is stronger than jiraiya with no proof other than he's oro so he must be strong and they get easily corrected through simple logic. This whole oro is stronger thing is even more pervasive than the whole kid buu>super buu thing with dbz.

[Hemostrat]

Except not really. :)

Jiraiya couldn't defeat Oro when Oro ran away. You can't say that Jiraiya held back because he don't know that. He don't know what happened in the fight, all we know is Orochimaru left and Jiraiya lost his "friend" forever. So I'm actually not saying Oro's stronger because he's Oro. Didn't think I'd have to point out something to obvious as that, since I would've thought everyone would remember something pretty important like that.

If Jiraiya was is stronger than every other Akatsuki memeber (besides the leader) why doesn't he step in and stop them when they're in a team or two hunting Bijuus? Makes no sense. He isn't stronger than them.

The quote that Itachi said can be interupted of him saying Jiraiya is stronger than him, or that Naruto is. A Kyuubi-fied Naruto and a Sannin is stronger than Itachi and Kisame. When Naruto started concentrating his Kyuubi chakra Kisame looked over in shock, and Itachi in even more shock.

Also please keep in mind, at the time Itachi had already used the Mangekyou Sharingan, which would seem to use up about 30% of his chakra supply. Along with the fact that Itachi wanted to take Naruto as silently as possible and not attract attention to himself. Given those two facts, defeating Jiraiya would become much more of a problem.


One final thing. Even though this kinda goes against my original statement I'd just like to state another view point on what Orochimaru said. "He is even stronger than me now" could mean more than Itachi is physically more powerful than him. Itachi has mastered the Sharingan, and even has the Mangekyou Sharingan. He can copy any jutsu that Orochimaru throws at him while Jiraiya on the other hand does much more ninpou jutsus that you wouldn't be able to copy.

[Akatsuki]

Except not really. :)

Jiraiya couldn't defeat Oro when Oro ran away. You can't say that Jiraiya held back because he don't know that. He don't know what happened in the fight, all we know is Orochimaru left and Jiraiya lost his "friend" forever. So I'm actually not saying Oro's stronger because he's Oro. Didn't think I'd have to point out something to obvious as that, since I would've thought everyone would remember something pretty important like that.

If Jiraiya was is stronger than every other Akatsuki memeber (besides the leader) why doesn't he step in and stop them when they're in a team or two hunting Bijuus? Makes no sense. He isn't stronger than them.

The quote that Itachi said can be interupted of him saying Jiraiya is stronger than him, or that Naruto is. A Kyuubi-fied Naruto and a Sannin is stronger than Itachi and Kisame. When Naruto started concentrating his Kyuubi chakra Kisame looked over in shock, and Itachi in even more shock.

Also please keep in mind, at the time Itachi had already used the Mangekyou Sharingan, which would seem to use up about 30% of his chakra supply. Along with the fact that Itachi wanted to take Naruto as silently as possible and not attract attention to himself. Given those two facts, defeating Jiraiya would become much more of a problem.


One final thing. Even though this kinda goes against my original statement I'd just like to state another view point on what Orochimaru said. "He is even stronger than me now" could mean more than Itachi is physically more powerful than him. Itachi has mastered the Sharingan, and even has the Mangekyou Sharingan. He can copy any jutsu that Orochimaru throws at him while Jiraiya on the other hand does much more ninpou jutsus that you wouldn't be able to copy. I'm guessing Itachi will have a hard time copying either one of their jutsus, because most of them are either bloodline limits/contracts with animals.

[torchamp]

Except not really. :)

Jiraiya couldn't defeat Oro when Oro ran away. You can't say that Jiraiya held back because he don't know that. He don't know what happened in the fight, all we know is Orochimaru left and Jiraiya lost his "friend" forever. So I'm actually not saying Oro's stronger because he's Oro. Didn't think I'd have to point out something to obvious as that, since I would've thought everyone would remember something pretty important like that.

If Jiraiya was is stronger than every other Akatsuki memeber (besides the leader) why doesn't he step in and stop them when they're in a team or two hunting Bijuus? Makes no sense. He isn't stronger than them.

The quote that Itachi said can be interupted of him saying Jiraiya is stronger than him, or that Naruto is. A Kyuubi-fied Naruto and a Sannin is stronger than Itachi and Kisame. When Naruto started concentrating his Kyuubi chakra Kisame looked over in shock, and Itachi in even more shock.

Also please keep in mind, at the time Itachi had already used the Mangekyou Sharingan, which would seem to use up about 30% of his chakra supply. Along with the fact that Itachi wanted to take Naruto as silently as possible and not attract attention to himself. Given those two facts, defeating Jiraiya would become much more of a problem.


One final thing. Even though this kinda goes against my original statement I'd just like to state another view point on what Orochimaru said. "He is even stronger than me now" could mean more than Itachi is physically more powerful than him. Itachi has mastered the Sharingan, and even has the Mangekyou Sharingan. He can copy any jutsu that Orochimaru throws at him while Jiraiya on the other hand does much more ninpou jutsus that you wouldn't be able to copy.

there are 2 reasons he won't go (2nd one's better):

1. It's not a mission, meaning if he goes out and kills a bunch of people for no reason without consent of the village he's going to get in serious trouble, and possibly be killed if it's considered a crime.

2. Okay let's say he kills itachi. Now he has the rest of aktsuki hunting him. We don't know the strength of all the others, it is very likely that atleast one (hidan, blue haired person, leader) could easily kill him. If he starts killing akatsuki members he knows that they will just be replaced and he will die for no reason at the hands of one of the members/the leader.

Itachi and kisame were in shock when naruto acessed the nine tails chakra because they prolly didn't expect a child to be able to harness the power of the nine tails

The reason itachi used his MS (more specifically, amaterasu) is because he was so scared of jiraiya that he used a technique of this magnitude simply to run away from him

[Hemostrat]

You have two flaws in your argument.

Jiraiya was going to kill *or tried to kill* Kisame and Itachi by trapping them in the frog's belly. Therefore, your whole "He was instructed by a village and he'd Akatsuki after him" logic is very much flawed. Even more so, everyone in Akatsuki is a S-ranked crimminal, you can kill them on site and nothing will happen to you with any village authourity.

Second, Itachi had to use Amaterasu. Itachi had roughly already used 60% of his Chakra, having used Tsukuyomi twice (once on Kakashi, once on Sasuke) in the same day. He was exhausted. There was no other way for them to break out of Jiraiya's ninpou alive without blowing a hole in it.

[Darth Payne]

Jiraiya > Itachi

Itachi flipping said so himself.

Itachi > Orochimaru

Orochimaru flipping said so himself.

Transitive Property:

Jiraiya>Itachi>Orochimaru

Jinraiya's currently the strongest ninja right now. He couldn't defeat Orochimaru when he left because he was probably holding back like Naruto was, and he's changed since then.

End of story.

[Hemostrat]

No. You're wrong.
Kisame said that himself and Itachi might have a problem with Jiraiya. No one has SEEN Jiraiya fight since Orochimaru left. Kisame probably took a stab in the dark.
PLUS Itachi didn't have his full amount of chakra, having already used Tsukuyomi once.

So, no, that isn't the end of the story. Please think more carefully next time before declaring your answer the one and only yes?

[Akatsuki]

No. You're wrong.
Kisame said that himself and Itachi might have a problem with Jiraiya. No one has SEEN Jiraiya fight since Orochimaru left. Kisame probably took a stab in the dark.
PLUS Itachi didn't have his full amount of chakra, having already used Tsukuyomi once.

So, no, that isn't the end of the story. Please think more carefully next time before declaring your answer the one and only yes? I wished that Jiraya was stronger than the bad guys, that way there could be some justice. Also, I think you're right. Itachi is not very bloody, considering how much people he could of killed in addition to the people he already killed, he just left the people gravely injured (e.g. Kakashi/Sasuke/Kurenai).

[Axel]

What about Hinata Vs Kamkuro(sp?) in II

I think Hinata would win for some reason.

[torchamp]

What about Hinata Vs Kamkuro(sp?) in II

I think Hinata would win for some reason.

kankuro's long range pupets wont let hinata near enough to him to use taijutsu. Also as a jounin, kankaro is probably dstronger than the chuunin hinata

[Darth Payne]

No. You're wrong.
Kisame said that himself and Itachi might have a problem with Jiraiya. No one has SEEN Jiraiya fight since Orochimaru left. Kisame probably took a stab in the dark.
PLUS Itachi didn't have his full amount of chakra, having already used Tsukuyomi once.

So, no, that isn't the end of the story. Please think more carefully next time before declaring your answer the one and only yes?
No. I'm right.

Itachi has stated that if he and Kisame took on Jiraiya, the best possible outcome would be a tie where all three are dead. And that was Itachi with a partner. Itachi alone is definitely weaker than Jiraiya.

[Hemostrat]

Really? Please refer me to this page then. I sure have my proof to back up my statement:

Kisame: "You can fight how and where you want, but I don't know... the time is wrong."
Itachi: "Ah. To meet those two and kill them. It's a good place to fight. So they can't augment the number of people they have."
Kisame: "It was good that we found him at the Ramen shop. But he's protected by one of the legendary three ninjas. That guy might be a match for the first of the leaf and one of the mist's seven strongest."
Itachi: "Ah, but... It's said that every strong man has a weakness"

Chapter 144, page 8.

Kisame stated that Jiraiya would take both of them (and Itachi wasn't at full power), Itachi said no such thing. I'll admit Jiraiya probably is very close to Itachi's level but he isn't at it. Itachi isn't one for un-needed bloodshed and doesn't want to do more than he has to. He doesn't really want to pick fights unless need be.

[Darth Payne]

Hmmm. I think what I saw was in the anime. I'm pretty sure Itachi said that somewhere.

[Akatsuki]

Yeah. I think I saw it too.

[Hemostrat]

If you can find the episode tell me and I'll watch it, then try to find the parallel for the manga. But if its only in the anime, its filler, therefore your whole argument is null and void.

[PlaydohDude]

Shika Part II vs. Roach

[orange peel]

Well, she did do that whole 'make a cure for that impossible to cure poison even by the standards of the guy that made the poison' thing...

You mean when Kankuro got poisoned by Sasori from his puppets and Sakura came and cured him in a second when Sasori's own grandmother couldn't and she was like 100 years old?

Its still kinda sad how Sasori's dream was never fulfilled...

Shika Part II vs. Roach

Please explain.

Jiraiya's the most powerful chracter in the show right now, and the Leader might actually be really weak, it's just everyone follows him because he has a killer plan only he can carry out.

Technically not true. Kakashi has quite an undetermined power, we haven't seen nearly all of what he can do AND most of Akatsuki (if not all) will be able to annihilate Jiraiya. Remember, even if Itachi will lose to Jiraiya, most travel in pairs. And two on one is preferably not fair but, quite common, except for the time when they were extracting Shukaku because they needded all members possible for the ceremony.

Not to mention, most Akatsuki are stronger or nearly as strong as Itachi. So if it was Akatsuki as a whole, I'd believe Jiraiya to crumble under two or more Akatsuki.

What about Hinata Vs Kamkuro(sp?) in II

I think Hinata would win for some reason.

I think its Kankuro. We don't see too much of either but I'd think Kankuro would win. His puppets were constructed by Sasori himself. Not to mention, they've completely changed since Naruto 1. But we never do see much of them either way. I, myself don't really think of Hinata as that hot (in skill) and Hinata V. Neji proves Neji to win even if its 2 years further into the future. Kankuro V. Neji might be good though.


A lot of things changed in Naruto 2. So Orochimaru's claim that Itachi was stronger than him (Where does he say this?) is invalid if you're talking Naruto 2.

[grim mouser]

About how high does Kakashi equal?
What about Naruto?
Sasuke?
Itachi?

[Hemostrat]

"A lot of things changed in Naruto 2. So Orochimaru's claim that Itachi was stronger than him (Where does he say this?) is invalid if you're talking Naruto 2"

Sasuke still stated in part two that he, nor Orochimaru, would be able to defeat Itachi in their present state.

And Orochimaru told Kabuto this some time after the Destruction of Konoha arc, I can't remember exactly when. I don't think it was Return of Itachi so it was probably near the beginning of the Tsunade hunt arc.

[orange peel]

I was thinking about Lee Vs. Sasuke. The time they fought before the chunin exams, Lee pwned Sasuke easily. Sasukke's Sharingan could keep up but he couldn't physically keep up. And I find Lee in the chunin exams was faster than Four Tales Naruto in Sasuke v. Naruto (By a lot. Faster not Stronger, BTW.) And Lee's speed must have doubled in Naruto 2 PLUS more Gates being opened and the Drunken Fist even more sharpened.

The only thing is Lee's Team V. Kisame displeased me about Lee and Neji's power. And Gai's too. They were facing a 30% form!

Additional Comment:
Rock Lee (ロック・リー, Rokku Rī?) is a fictional character in the anime and manga series Naruto. He is modeled after the late Bruce Lee.

According to an interview with Masashi Kishimoto, the creator of the manga series, in Shonen Jump's 'Naruto Anime Profiles Episodes 1-37', Rock Lee is his most fun character to draw. He also has stated that Sakura and Rock Lee were meant to symbolize human weakness (at least in the beginning).

In Shonen Jump's character popularity polls, Lee consistently ranked in the Top 10 in the first four polls, even making the Top 5 once. In the more recent polls, however, Lee has fallen out of the Top 10.

I find this interesting. I'm not saying its complete 100% fact though. Since its Wikipedia.

Anyways, how about Rock Lee (Naruto 2) Versus Neji (Naruto 2)? I prefer people who have read up to the latest Japenese Naruto chapters to comment on this because we might miss something. Notice I said prefer. Others can still answer if they want to.

[Hemostrat]

I'd just have to go with Neji since he's a Jonin. We haven't really seen anything from either of them so you can't say anything about which is better.

[Akatsuki]

I'd have to go with Neji too, because he is a Jounnin, and he might have improved his technique by a lot with the Byakugan, which is a bloodline limit. Lee does not have a bloodline limit, so I might think that Neji has an advantage.

[Darth Payne]

In the event where we don't know the exact powers, we have to go by rank, which would make Neji the winner.

[orange peel]

But Lee can open a lot of gates so that makes up for the Bloodline Limit.

I heard something/rumors about Neji having an All-Eight Gate Opening Technique or something. Or it might close the opponents gates.

[torchamp]

But Lee can open a lot of gates so that makes up for the Bloodline Limit.

I heard something/rumors about Neji having an All-Eight Gate Opening Technique or something. Or it might close the opponents gates.

the closest thing to that is the byakugan user's gentle fist, a technique in which the 64 tenketsus (points that distribute chakra flow throughout the body) are hit repeatedly to block or damage them

[orange peel]

Which Neji can do.

However, Lee neither uses chakra or knows how. He's 100% Taijutsu.

[Akatsuki]

It will still hurt if his chakra pathways are destroyed. It will hurt a lot.

[orange peel]

Do you mean clogged up? If so, then not really. Hinata didn't even notice it until Neji pulled back her sleeve.

But if someone were to literally destroy/rip out all your chakra vessels and points, it might hurt. Don't know who can though.

[Akatsuki]

Yeah. But I doubt if we do even have chakra pathways. Most of us aren't ninja.

[orange peel]

I was talking about the ninjas in Naruto but we probably don't.

What if we did?

And how about Gai V. Kakashi?

[strife4life]

like what was stated earlier in this forum it would matter the situation in a life or death situation kakashi would most likly kill off gai but in a friendly spar i belive gai would win

[grim mouser]

It's about even, but in a deathmatch, I think Kakashi.

[orange peel]

Its stated a couple times in Naruto 2 that Kakashi has VERY fast Taijutsu that's above Lee and even Gai, a long-range Jutsu master, keener smell than Kiba, and is smarter than Shikimaru.

[Akatsuki]

Really? I would like to know more, please.

[gtw1983]

I don't know if it has been brought up yet but I personally would like to see a match of


Itachi VS Yondaime


I believe that in the end The fourth would win but It would still be a good fight in my opinion.

[strife4life]

what i would like to see though impossible:( is zabuza or haku vs. garra(part 1 of course)my friend says garra would beat either of them easily but i think they could do pretty well what do you think?

[Rakath]

Its stated a couple times in Naruto 2 that Kakashi has VERY fast Taijutsu that's above Lee and even Gai, a long-range Jutsu master, keener smell than Kiba, and is smarter than Shikimaru.

Wonderful logic, since Naruto said it it must be true.

Now, go eat your ramen since it's the only food worth eating in life.

Really, taking what Naruto says as literal truth is like taking yaoi-fangirl screeching as literal truth.

Kakashi is good, but he is good for being rounded in all areas, in a match using just that aspect of strength, even Kakashi's greatest mimic will lose. He can't outsniff Kiba, beat Shikamaru in Shogi, or push Gai out of a Sumo ring.

However, he is probably the fastest ninja alive (since Yondaime is dead and all).

[grim mouser]

I agree... where'd you even see that?

[orange peel]

Wonderful logic, since Naruto said it it must be true.

Now, go eat your ramen since it's the only food worth eating in life.

Really, taking what Naruto says as literal truth is like taking yaoi-fangirl screeching as literal truth.

Kakashi is good, but he is good for being rounded in all areas, in a match using just that aspect of strength, even Kakashi's greatest mimic will lose. He can't outsniff Kiba, beat Shikamaru in Shogi, or push Gai out of a Sumo ring.

However, he is probably the fastest ninja alive (since Yondaime is dead and all).

I REALLY think this is true. And this wasn't just stated by Naruto. Kakashi and Sakura both said it at different points of the arc.

Ramen's good but I like (Real) Chinese food better. Shogi's a really fun game. Gai's probably not a good Sumo. I find Yondaime is incredibly fast. And who's yaoi-fangirl?

[Rakath]

'yaoi-fangirl screeching' is my term for the 'logic' behind things like SasukexNaruto and the like, yaoi-fangirl isn't a person, it's a group.

Kakashi probably is better in all areas (except stronger than Gai) mostly due to difference in level. And in a test of straight IQ, Shikamaru would win.

[torchamp]

I REALLY think this is true. And this wasn't just stated by Naruto. Kakashi and Sakura both said it at different points of the arc.

Ramen's good but I like (Real) Chinese food better. Shogi's a really fun game. Gai's probably not a good Sumo. I find Yondaime is incredibly fast. And who's yaoi-fangirl?

ramen is japanese, just like to point that out

[orange peel]

ramen is japanese, just like to point that out

I put real in not to differ it from the Ramen but to point out I like the genuine kind better than the crap kind you find at some restaurants in Chinatown.


And Shikimaru probably would win in a straight IQ test, but Kakashi's a genius if you didn't know that, Rakath. REmember when he became a chunin?

[torchamp]

I put real in not to differ it from the Ramen but to point out I like the genuine kind better than the crap kind you find at some restaurants in Chinatown.


And Shikimaru probably would win in a straight IQ test, but Kakashi's a genius if you didn't know that, Rakath. REmember when he became a chunin?

i think yo umean jounin, we never see kakashi as a chuunin. A genius in the narutoverse is anyone who accomplishes more than what is expected from them or their age, faily heritage, ect.

[Rakath]

I put real in not to differ it from the Ramen but to point out I like the genuine kind better than the crap kind you find at some restaurants in Chinatown.


And Shikimaru probably would win in a straight IQ test, but Kakashi's a genius if you didn't know that, Rakath. REmember when he became a chunin?

Is he a Super Genius?

^_^

[orange peel]

I definitely meant chunin. He passed the chunin exams when he was Eight.

[torchamp]

I definitely meant chunin. He passed the chunin exams when he was Eight.

alright, my bad

[Hemostrat]

Wasn't that Itachi?
I always get the two mixed up.

Graduated from the Academy at 7... able to use the Sharingan at 8, and was an ANBU captain at 13.

Right? ^^'

[torchamp]

Wasn't that Itachi?
I always get the two mixed up.

Graduated from the Academy at 7... able to use the Sharingan at 8, and was an ANBU captain at 13.

Right? ^^'

yup

*filla*

[orange peel]

Wasn't that Itachi?
I always get the two mixed up.

Graduated from the Academy at 7... able to use the Sharingan at 8, and was an ANBU captain at 13.

Right? ^^'

Those numbers are a little off, but I definitely was confusing him with Itachi. They both did that. Minus the Sharingan and ANBU part. We don't know about that.

[MagnabladerX4]

Those numbers are a little off, but I definitely was confusing him with Itachi. They both did that. Minus the Sharingan and ANBU part. We don't know about that.


Actually we do know that, anime stated it in the murder flashbacks of sasuke's clan during eppy's 129-131. He was reading about itachi during class one day. It's all canon.

[orange peel]

I was talking about how we don't know when Kakashi got the Sharingan mastered. And mastered is the wrong term. More like found out how to utilize. I'm assuming directly after the transplant. And He probably didn't go Anbu.

As for Itachi, I'm SURE he did all that, in the filler, but the Hemostrat's numbers are most likely off.

Sorry 'bout that. Didn't word it clearly.

[Akatsuki]

I definitely meant chunin. He passed the chunin exams when he was Eight. Make it 6. SPOILERS!!!


Advancement Data
Academy Grad Age: 5
Chuunin Exam Age: 6

Missions Completed
D-Rank: 197
C-Rank: 189
B-Rank: 414
A-Rank: 277
S-Rank: 39
Courtesy of Leafninja.com

[orange peel]

How is that a spoiler really?

I really thought it was eight in the manga. But I might be wrong.

And exactly how does Leafninja know how many missions he did of each?

Sorry if this looks like an attack on you. (And BTW, the Mission Rankings are just like that of Pokemon Mystery Dungeon! Except for Stars after S.)

[Rakath]

Leafninja does translate some of the extra background info, like pages from Bingo Books.

[orange peel]

And when does it show the contents of Zabuza's Bingo Book in the Manga?

[torchamp]

And when does it show the contents of Zabuza's Bingo Book in the Manga?

i'm pretyty sure they're talking about the data books which are released evry so often. they contain info on jutsus and characters

[orange peel]

Oh, do you mean those that come alone without the manga? Filler. Or the samll bios IN the manga? Kinda Filler.

Its not a big deal anyways.

[Hemostrat]

I was talking about how we don't know when Kakashi got the Sharingan mastered. And mastered is the wrong term. More like found out how to utilize. I'm assuming directly after the transplant. And He probably didn't go Anbu.

As for Itachi, I'm SURE he did all that, in the filler, but the Hemostrat's numbers are most likely off.

Sorry 'bout that. Didn't word it clearly.

My number aren't filler, I'm almost positive they're 100% correct to the manga. If you really wish, I'll find them sicne I know they're in Sasuke's flashback in the Retrieve Sasuke arc.

[Near]

Are you like, directly reading this off Wikipedia, Orange?

And yeah, I'm pretty sure Kakashi has a great Taijutsu, great sniffing abilities, and is a 'genius' [like half the characters there, yeah]
But he's in no way better in those things that Gai/Kiba/Shika on order.

[orange peel]

Do you mean in order?

No, I really did read this directly from the manga. And who of the other "geniuses" that you mention passed the chunin exams and became a chunin so early?

Hemostrat, I watched the Anime for the Naruto V. Sasuke fight. Never actually read the manga of that part. I skimmed through that a bit.

But Itachi's accomplishments were mentioned by his father (or teacher) in the flashback/

[Rakath]

Remember, Naruto said that Kakashi was better than everyone at everything. This is Naruto saying it, so it probably is not 100% accurate.

Kakashi graduated so early because he is good in all areas, but he isn't perfect in all areas. In a battle strictly of that one ability (Senses for Kakashi vs. Kiba, Inteligence in Kakashi vs. Shikamaru, Grappling combat for Kakashi vs. Gai) Kakashi will not defeat them. His abilities are a mimic, meaning he might match them, but he won't best them. (However, Kakashi could probably beat all of them but Gai).

[Silver_Hammer]

Or Itachi would need to wear glasses, LMAO. But it'd certainly be a suprise if he went blind.

And for Sakura v. Kabuto, I'd think Kabuto would win. Sakura might have more power and knowledge. But experience wins the day. Plus Kabuto is a genius.

You know, going blind might actually make Itachi stronger. Because typically, in your average ninja or samurai anime, blind warriors inherently fight better than warriors who can see. I think that's in the laws of anime somewhere. XD But then of course, losing Sharingan would take his edge away, so who knows.

[Odama123]

That's the stupidest thing i've ever heard.Going blind will never make you stronger. If Itachi became blind he wouldn't be able to use his sharigan or see his opponent. Sasuke would kill him in an instant

[grim mouser]

Yeah... How'd Itachi beat Kakashi (at least sort of)? Sharingan... which is impossible without eyesight.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

how about itachi v. orochimaru? that would be a battle i'd like to see.

[torchamp]

how about itachi v. orochimaru? that would be a battle i'd like to see.

itachi wins, stated by oro himself.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

mmm.but i think master of the sharingan(itachi)would haved been already in a winning streak.not just cause he's lessed experinced,but rather the help from his bodyguards and the weekness he'd be able to find.

[Nightmare7]

so itachi wins against orochimaru in part 1 or of the series?

[Akatsuki]

Yes. Itachi is stronger than Orichimaru. Orichimaru said so. End of Story #1. However, things might be different in Series two. Since Orichimaru MAY have obtained Sasuke as a container, it might be closer.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

what i thought

[Axel]

In the manga, Spoiler warning....highlight to see...

Orochimaru is almost equal to evading and fighting Naruto at three tails, and somewhat at four tails, and he doesn't have Sasuke as a container right away at Naruto II. So it depends what you think of him Vs Itachi in II...

[torchamp]

so itachi wins against orochimaru in part 1 or of the series?

and part 2, oro said that even in sasuke's body he still woudn't be able to win

[Nightmare7]

he even said it in part 2?if he did when?dont remember reading that part

[Aarikku]

One of my friends and I came up with a game where we each pick a ninja and explain why they'd beat the other's.

My friend picked Shikamaru, and I picked Rock Lee. Here's the two options:

1) Rock Lee, being rather unstrategic, would end up getting himself Kage Mane no Jutsu'd. However, Rock Lee, being strong, would break out or wait 'til Shikamaru ran out of chakra - which he does in quite a few battles.

2) Rock Lee would open some gates (unlikely). Shikamaru would Kage Mane no Jutsu Lee (unlikely with the gates open) and wait until Rock Lee's gates killed him (again, unlikely considering only the 8th gate would kill him, and he'd break out long before then).

[torchamp]

he even said it in part 2?if he did when?dont remember reading that part

sasuke says it when he sees naruto again. Something along the lines of even with our powers combined, we're still not strong enough to kill my brother

[Nightmare7]

thats odd i remember reading the manga a while ago unlees this goes above 330?

[Hemostrat]

Nope, its in 309 or so.

[Nightmare7]

oh alright than thanx il make sure il read it but still cant believe after 2 years itachi is still overwhelming for orochimaru and sasuke

[orange peel]

How about Naruto V. Lee? ;)

[Akatsuki]

Good Question. Let's think the advantages Naruto has over Lee:
-Ninjutsu capabilities (Like Kage Bunshin)
-Rasengan
-Kyuubi

Lee's advantages:
-Fast Speed
-Stronger
-Can open Gates (even though I would doubt he would use this in a match)
-Better Taijutsus.

[torchamp]

How about Naruto V. Lee? ;)

pre skip - lee beats naruto unless he goes one tails
post-skip - as of right now i'd say naruto would probably beat lee, definately after he masters his new jutsu

[orange peel]

how bout orange peel v. naruto?

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

naruto cause of his nine-tail form LOL

[yasmin]

i got an idea how bout sasuke vs kidamaru id have to say these

kidamaru would win cause heck sasuke didnt do anythin while garra was in demon form and garra didnt even need his demon form for that figth and i personally think kidamaru is superior in his kenkia genkia and his taijujtsu cause he toke out a whole field of naruto plus he fougth drunken rock lee and was able to block his moves.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

here's one that was random (since everyone likes zabuza) orochimaru V. zabuza or haku. but since zabuza is slow when it comes to orochi's speed I think oro just over speed which is dumb. then again, zabuza could counter oro through mist, making it almost impossible for oro to win but meh.

[Cloud Sylver]

here's one that was random (since everyone likes zabuza) orochimaru V. zabuza or haku. but since zabuza is slow when it comes to orochi's speed I think oro just over speed which is dumb. then again, zabuza could counter oro through mist, making it almost impossible for oro to win but meh.

We know Orochimaru could take Kakashi.

Kakashi had a hard time with Zabuza, but won in the end.

With that, we can conclude that Haku/Zabuza < Orochimaru.

I'll be seeing Lee vs. Sarutobi next. T_T

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

shikamaru Vs. shino

gotta see this one.

[Stuntman Mike]

Yomi from yu yu hakusho vs Itachi that would be the match of the century a superb hearing blind man vs itachi genjutsu master.

[Cloud Sylver]

Yomi from yu yu hakusho vs Itachi that would be the match of the century a superb hearing blind man vs itachi genjutsu master.

How much do you watch Yu-Yu?

[Junior]

Itachi would probably lose since most of his techniques depend on sight.

[JunKurisu]

Deidara Vs. Tobi
Shikamaru+Rock Lee Vs. Kakashi
Neji Vs. Gaara Vs. Haku

discuss.

[Cloud Sylver]

Deidara Vs. Tobi
Shikamaru+Rock Lee Vs. Kakashi
Neji Vs. Gaara Vs. Haku

discuss.

There is not enough information to conclude about Tobi vs. Deidara.

If Naruto and Sakura cannot touch Kakashi, Rock Lee and Shikamaru won't.

Gaara wins, because Neji is a close-range fighter and cannot penetrate Gaara's sand. Haku, even though he has the needles and crystal ice mirrors, fail in comparison to the range and defense of Gaara's sand.

[Junior]

Deidara Vs. Tobi
Shikamaru+Rock Lee Vs. Kakashi
Neji Vs. Gaara Vs. Haku

discuss.

Deidara vs. Tobi would be too hard to discuss due to lack of info.

----------------------------

^ Disagreed with Clouds comment about Shikamaru and Lee unable to touch Kakashi because Shikamaru's strategic mind combined with extreme speed with Kage Mane etc. cannot be beat or is very hard to be beat.

But I have to agree, that Kakashi would beat Shikamaru and Lee because Kakashi has the smarts of Shikamaru. Kakashi also has much more experience so Kakashi would out-wit him.

Kakashi can definitely deal with Rock Lee's Taijutsu because of his Sharingan, as well as many long ranged, as well as short and mid range, Ninjutsu and Kakashi is really good at Taijutsu too.

----------------------------

^ I disagree again.
Neji > Gaara > Haku = Neji > Gaara > Haku etc..
^ That proves that > and < aren't always right.

But more importantly, why do I say that?

Gaara's defence is made by chakra being poured into the sand. As you all know, the Hyuuga clan can disrupt the chakra flows and therefore, stopping it from affecting an object. That would render Gaara's sand shield useless, leaving him VERY open for a close-combat fight.

Gaara can beat Haku because Haku's techniques are simply not strong enough to penetrate Gaara's absolute defence, even his nromal ones.

Haku vs. Neji would simply be kamikaze.

[Cloud Sylver]

Deidara vs. Tobi would be too hard to discuss due to lack of info.

----------------------------

^ Disagreed with Clouds comment about Shikamaru and Lee unable to touch Kakashi because Shikamaru's strategic mind combined with extreme speed with Kage Mane etc. cannot be beat or is very hard to be beat.

But I have to agree, that Kakashi would beat Shikamaru and Lee because Kakashi has the smarts of Shikamaru. Kakashi also has much more experience so Kakashi would out-wit him.

Kakashi can definitely deal with Rock Lee's Taijutsu because of his Sharingan, as well as many long ranged, as well as short and mid range, Ninjutsu and Kakashi is really good at Taijutsu too.

----------------------------

^ I disagree again.
Neji > Gaara > Haku = Neji > Gaara > Haku etc..
^ That proves that > and < aren't always right.

But more importantly, why do I say that?

Gaara's defence is made by chakra being poured into the sand. As you all know, the Hyuuga clan can disrupt the chakra flows and therefore, stopping it from affecting an object. That would render Gaara's sand shield useless, leaving him VERY open for a close-combat fight.

Gaara can beat Haku because Haku's techniques are simply not strong enough to penetrate Gaara's absolute defence, even his nromal ones.

Haku vs. Neji would simply be kamikaze.

Three way vs. matches suck.

The Hyuuga clan can disrupt the chakra flow, but since there are no chakra points in sand, the best Neji can do is disallow the use of the sand for a short time.

It depends on how literal you want to take it.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

gaara vs. kisame disscus.

[Tasuku]

Kisame would win.

Gaara's sand won't work if its wet.

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

Kisame would win.

Gaara's sand won't work if its wet.

what about gaara's sand armor?

[yasmin]

you guys remember the filler when garra gets wet from that one guy ya thats what would happen people!

on a better note how bout these for a figth

Garra vs drunken rock lee

[Tasuku]

what about gaara's sand armor?
That's still sand though, if it gets wet, it would fall off of him.

EDIT: you guys remember the filler when garra gets wet from that one guy ya thats what would happen people!

That was actually a filler? Lol. I was just going by common sense.

[jim2069]

how bout
team snake vs new team 7

sasuke ............. naruto ? my opinion sasuke wins only person who will kill sasuke will be itachi or kabuto

karin .......... sakura ? my opinion karin would win by using cheap trick that will break sakura's mind because she could say she had relation with sasuke which would blow sakura away.

Suigetsu Hozuki .......... sai ? my opinion suigetsu his power to turn to water takes away long distance fighting

Jugo .............. kakashi ? toss up

[yasmin]

actually if it were sasuke vs naruto if naruto had to he would use faton:rasenshurikan or unlock more tails of the fox then sasuke would be screwed.with the karin sakura figth it be a draw most likely.

[Hemostrat]

Karin has been proved useless, all she does it find locate people due to her chakra sensing or something like that. Sakura would easily win that battle. But overall, we can't compare the two teams yet because we know next to nothing about Suigetsu, Juugo and Karin.

And with the Gaara vs Neji fight, Gaara would win. First of all, Neji doesn't have the speed that Lee or Sasuke has. Even if somehow, Neji was able to get through Gaara's automatic defense he can't get through the sand that covers his body. Neji's juuken wasn't able to get through Kidomaru's spider armor, why would he be able to get through an even stronger defense that Gaara has?

[yasmin]

ok first of all yes neji juuken was able to get through kidamarus spider armor.second if it was a match neji vs garra it would end with neji winning what you guys forgot is that garra's sand has chackra in it so neji can stop the chackra flow to the sand and isolate garra without and defense execpt the sand armor which once again neji can get through cause the chackra thats in the sand armor would stop follwin and lose that armor and if all that fails neji can get a hose.and you guys forgot that neji absolute defense if even better than garra's.

[Hemostrat]

Actually, you're wrong. Neji used his Hakke Rokujyu Yonshou on Kidomaru in chapter 194 and on page 5 Neji says "How can this be?" and on page 6 Kidomaru's golden skin is falling off him and he's fine. Neji never used his juuken style again, he defeated Kidomaru by a type of juuken but it wasn't his eighty-four divine strikes.

Gaara's ultimate defense is much better then Neji's. Neji must keep rotating for his to work and can be stopped by webs holding him down. Gaara on the other hand, can only be beaten by pure speed and power. Neji doesn't have the speed that Lee and Sasuke had. Hell, even Kimmimaro couldn't get through his automatic sand. Even if somehow Neji got through his auto sand, he'd still have to get through the sand that covers his body. And yes, it contains chakra but that doesn't mean that Neji can get rid of it. He has to hit Gaara's chakra channels, and as long as Gaara has the sand covering his body it'll have the same effect on Kidomaru's golden skin had on him.

Neji would lose.

[Junior]

Can't be bothered posting reasons so I'm going to make it brief.

Naruto beats Sasuke due to his Fuuton: Rasenshuriken and his tails.

Tied between the girls, but Sakura may be able to overcome Karin after a while because she can heal herself if she wanted to.

Suigetsu beats Sai.

Kakashi ftw due to his experience, Mangekyo Sharingan, he knows thousands of ninjutsus, but then again, Jugo has some sweet moves.

[Cloud Sylver]

Can't be bothered posting reasons so I'm going to make it brief.

Naruto beats Sasuke due to his Fuuton: Rasenshuriken and his tails.

Tied between the girls, but Sakura may be able to overcome Karin after a while because she can heal herself if she wanted to.

Suigetsu beats Sai.

Kakashi ftw due to his experience, Mangekyo Sharingan, he knows thousands of ninjutsus, but then again, Jugo has some sweet moves.

Karin is a took for the storyline. So far Karin has showed no sign of being on par with Sakura. What makes you confident it would be a tie?

I'm not so sure Naruto would use the tails. Naruto wouldn't want to resort to the tails even if he had to, because him and Sasuke are rivals. Naruto would want to show Sasuke that he could win without further help.

I'll take it that Suigetsu is on par with Zabuza, so no complaints there.

Kakashi would definitely win. Juugu answers to Sasuke, and Sasuke is on par or just below Kakashi.

[Junior]

Orochi's experiments have special and very strong powers.

True, but Naruto will use it if he has to.

Hmm.. I think Sasuke is below Kakashi, but you do have a point there.

[Cloud Sylver]

Orochi's experiments have special and very strong powers.

Indeed, but there's an exception to everything.

[curse mark brownie]

how bout itachi vs the yondaime
didnt read all the posts so didnt know if this was already brought up.

jutsu master vs. yellow flash

Additional Comment:

or if naruto was never used as a host for kyuubi

itachi vs. kyuubi

[Junior]

Actually, the Genjutsu master.

Yondaime would win IMO. He'd be far too fast for Itachi to catch him in one of his Genjutsus.

Kyuubi can kill everyone.

[curse mark brownie]

there are things to debate in their.

itachi vs. kyuubi

itachi would use mangekyou on kyuubi torture the living hell out of it for 3 days
and use some kind of huge nasty jutsu to finish him off.

but other than that one swipe of kyuubi's paw and yuuumm pancakes itachi flavored

[Llanowar lord, Grenseal]

yondaime vs kyuubi

hows that one?

[curse mark brownie]

just brought it up. i'm bored and wanted to see what people would comment bout it.

[Junior]

yondaime vs kyuubi

hows that one?

That's already kamikaze.

If Yondaime doesn't know sealing techniques, Kyuubi hands down. Ooo.. that reminds me of a song. xD

[animeandmangafreak]

ummmm what kind of strong ninja doesn't know sealing techniques??

[Junior]

Kakashi? Naruto?

[animeandmangafreak]

Kakashi? Naruto?

are u super sure that kakashi and naruto don't know??

[Junior]

I'm pretty sure.

[animeandmangafreak]

kyuubi > everything in naruto

[Junior]

Not if it's against every Shinobi in the world.

[animeandmangafreak]

ok, yeah but 1 on 1 yes it is.

[curse mark brownie]

how bout this kyuubi vs remaining akatsuki

[Cloud Sylver]

Kakashi? Naruto?

Kakashi sealed the curse mark on Sasuke during the chunnin exams.

[Junior]

how bout this kyuubi vs remaining akatsuki

Akatsuki if Kyuubi has a host, but if Kyuubi is free, it pwns.

Kakashi sealed the curse mark on Sasuke during the chunnin exams.

I forgot all about that.

[curse mark brownie]

HAHA

naruto vs luffy

[Junior]

Luffy hands down! Oh god, that song again. LOL!

[curse mark brownie]

Ok whats the song.didnt exactly know what you were talking about a couple of comments back.

or maybe.....did you post it on a different thread.

[Junior]

Hands Down by Dashboard Confessional. Lol.

Yondaime vs. Sandaime Hokage and Godaime Hokage. Discuss?

[curse mark brownie]

hhhhmmm probably yondaime. IDK

[Junior]

Yeah, pretty hard one. =/

But I too think Yondaime would win due to his super sped ability to teleport so fast. Sandaime would be using his Katon and Doton jutsus but misses while Godaime would just be punching.

[curse mark brownie]

hhhmmm idk.

rob lucci(cp9 from one piece) vs yondaime

or kid buu vs yondaime

[Junior]

Now that's what you call hard to compare. O_O

[Cloud Sylver]

Now that's what you call hard to compare. O_O

You may as well compare Goku vs. Superman. xD

Buu wins, hands down. Yondaime cannot match Buu in anything, including speed.

[Junior]

Well it is a different anime. lol

[Cloud Sylver]

Well it is a different anime. lol

I was on a Java chat once, and we were in a discussion about Naruto. We began comparing other fictional people, and someone mentioned Mario vs. Naruto. xD

[curse mark brownie]

LMAO well you can compare mario's fireballs to sasuke's housenka no jutsu
and his growth to choji's jutsu

[Junior]

Rofl! Mario FTW! Cuase he can kill Naruto in one jump.

[animeandmangafreak]

mario, lol, mario rocks. actually luffy would lose if they fought in water

[Junior]

Present Ino vs. Present Sakura?

[animeandmangafreak]

we haven't seen ino's new attks. though i would think sakura would win

[Junior]

I can get a picture of her new attacks, like that one of which her father did while the Sand and Souds invasion.

[animeandmangafreak]

I can get a picture of her new attacks, like that one of which her father did while the Sand and Souds invasion.

well did u guys watch the naruto fillers. ino said she wanted to be a medic ninja lik sakura. i doubt the fillers would say something that has no impact with the storyline at all.

[Junior]

I meant in combat. Who would win in combat?

[animeandmangafreak]

I meant in combat. Who would win in combat?

i said sakura if u read the post earlier and really, before what could sakura do. without any powers at all she managed to tie with ino, isn't that a bit wierd.

[Junior]

That's confusing. =S

[animeandmangafreak]

we haven't seen ino's new attks. though i would think sakura would win

this is confusing??

[Junior]

No this. Below.

i said sakura if u read the post earlier and really, before what could sakura do. without any powers at all she managed to tie with ino, isn't that a bit wierd.

[curse mark brownie]

yes it is confusing

[yasmin]

amm present sakura vs present ino hmm lets see inner sakura beat's ino's jujtsu.in a fist figth crazy strength by sakura.in medical sakura was thougth by tsunade so she can heal fast.all sign's point towards sakura winning!

[curse mark brownie]

or maybe ino,its pretty close since she has advanced her possession jutsu.
remember in the exams it was a draw.and both of them have gotten better
IDK im confused right now,because i know im saying something wrong.

[Junior]

Ino may have learned the jutsu in where she can make their opponent's turn on themselves or against each other.

I think it was called, Ninpo, Shinranshin no Jutsu?

[animeandmangafreak]

Ino may have learned the jutsu in where she can make their opponent's turn on themselves or against each other.

I think it was called, Ninpo, Shinranshin no Jutsu?

i don't see y this jutsu has any use if its one on one

[Junior]

Well, you can get someone to bash themselves, so why not?

[curse mark brownie]

hahaha funny yet pretty horrible to watch.

[Junior]

Well, Ino could make Sakura beat the crap outa herself. xD

[curse mark brownie]

haha lmao........perverted thought.......

[Junior]

Rofl. Ewww! LOL! ><"

[animeandmangafreak]

haha lmao........perverted thought.......

are u talking about ........ masterbating. man u sicko.

on topic sakura and ino would be a boring fight just like the last fight they had.

[Junior]

There is nothing wrong with masturbating. over 80% of males do it.

Nope, it would be more interesting this time seeing as they should all be stronger. Besides, they only had one fight in the whole series so far.

[animeandmangafreak]

There is nothing wrong with masturbating. over 80% of males do it.

Nope, it would be more interesting this time seeing as they should all be stronger. Besides, they only had one fight in the whole series so far.

are u saying that u are one of those 80%???:eek:

i still think it would be a bring fight.