Gruuling Beatdown:Standard Edition

[TenteiKarite]

Gruuling Beatdown
v10.0 T-II Format
Last Tweaked on :06/09/06

Lands (20)
----------
5 Forest
5 Mountains
4 Stomping Grounds
4 Karpulsan Forest
2 Skargg, the Rage Pits

Creature Spells (20)
-------------------
4 Kird Ape
4 Scab-Clan Mauler
4 Burning Tree Shaman
4 Rumbling Slum
2 Streetbreaker Wurm
2 Borborygmos

Non-Creature Spells (18)
------------------------
4 Char
4 Threaten
2 Sundering Vitae
4 Wildsize
2 Recollect
2 Savage Twister

Artifacts (2)
------------

2 Gruul War Plow

TOTAL: 60 Cards.


-T/K

[Ordyh]

-2x Gruul Turf
+2x Stomping Ground

-1x Seal of Fire
-2x Savage Twister (side board it)
+3x Char

r/f/bump my dimir control dek

[MTGplayer89]

-1 Mountain
-1 Forest
+2 Stomping Ground

-2 Savage Twister (good card but you are hurting yourself as well with it)
+2 Char

-1 Seal of Fire
+1 Furnace of Rath

Please take a look at my token deck in sig. Thanks! :cool:

[TenteiKarite]

Made Some Major Changes, hopefully for the better.

I'll be playtesting:

Yamibushi's Flame VS Flames of the Blood Hand
and
Skarrgan Pit-Skulk VS Silhana Ledgewalker

Anybody have any Ideas for Fixes?

-T/K

[vercingetorix3]

You have 4 Stomping Grounds, but you cannot afford Rumbling Slum or Char...?...

Anyways, I'd replace Sundering Vitae with Naturalize. If you can get your hands on some Might of Oaks ($1-2.50) as well, those would go well with the Pit-Skulk or even the Ledgewalker (the former moreso than the latter). I'd guess I'd take out Wildsize to make room for MoO.

If you could critique with Bronze Bombshell deck, that'd be awesome. Thanks.

[TenteiKarite]

You have 4 Stomping Grounds, but you cannot afford Rumbling Slum or Char...?...

Anyways, I'd replace Sundering Vitae with Naturalize. If you can get your hands on some Might of Oaks ($1-2.50) as well, those would go well with the Pit-Skulk or even the Ledgewalker (the former moreso than the latter). I'd guess I'd take out Wildsize to make room for MoO.

If you could critique with Bronze Bombshell deck, that'd be awesome. Thanks.
Because all of my money (and a testicle) went to getting the Stomping Grounds.

Vitae is Better than Naturalize, simply because I can still use it if I'm tapped out (via Convoke, because most likely, I WILL have 3 Creatures out)

I MAY toss in a few Might of Oaks, If I can get ahold of some... MoO+Skybreaker=GTFO,N00b.

Thanks for the Bump, and the Suggestion. Anybody Else?

-T/K

[ShroomXIII]

add dryad sophisticates and moldervine cloaks.....dryad sophisticate has nonbasic landwalk and moldervine cloak adds +3/+3 and adds trample.

[TenteiKarite]

add dryad sophisticates and moldervine cloaks.....dryad sophisticate has nonbasic landwalk and moldervine cloak adds +3/+3 and adds trample.

I know what Sophisticate Does, But Skarrgan Pit-Skulk's got Bloodthirst, and is also often unblockable.

Cloaks are good, yes, but I like the touch of the Magemarks (MUCH more Boostage there) more, and also, Cloaks are only a +3/+3 with Dredge 2 (I know, because I used to run 3...)

yea, and another thing about the Pit-Skulk, it's unblockable, even if all they have is basic land (rare, but possible), with a Wurmweaver Coil (7/7-8/8, unblockable by stuff weaker than it, which, might I add, is a LOT)

Thanks for the Suggestion, and I'll take Cloaks into consideration for Wildsize's Spot, when I Tweak my deck next.

-T/K

[ShroomXIII]

I know what Sophisticate Does, But Skarrgan Pit-Skulk's got Bloodthirst, and is also often unblockable.

Cloaks are good, yes, but I like the touch of the Magemarks (MUCH more Boostage there) more, and also, Cloaks are only a +3/+3 with Dredge 2 (I know, because I used to run 3...)

yea, and another thing about the Pit-Skulk, it's unblockable, even if all they have is basic land (rare, but possible), with a Wurmweaver Coil (7/7-8/8, unblockable by stuff weaker than it, which, might I add, is a LOT)

Thanks for the Suggestion, and I'll take Cloaks into consideration for Wildsize's Spot, when I Tweak my deck next.



-T/K

you're right......lol, fists of ironwood adds trample

[TenteiKarite]

you're right......lol, fists of ironwood adds trample
yea, but so does Gruul War Plow;)

Imagine, I Swing(plow already in play), Sac off Seal of Fire, Summon Skarrgan Skybreaker, end.
Next Turn, I play a Mana down, Hook Skybreaker up with a Wurmweaver Coil, Swing for 12/12 Tramplingageness, Sac off to blast another 12 at the opp's face, and sac off the Coil while it's on the stack, to get a 6/6 Wurm (with trample from the Plow) If they didn't die from the Skybreaker, they'll die next turn, when I Dowsing Shaman the Coil Back, and hook the token up to it for anothjer round of butt-whooping.

That's how a lot of my games have ended... funny, isn't it

-T/K

Additional Comment:
I've made some major tweaks to the deck.

Yesterday, I took it to a local Tourney, and placed 3rd, which isn't too bad, considering my competition.

Skargaan Skybreaker+Wurmweaver Coil Broke Games. Swing, Sac, Laugh.

The most effective weapon in the deck, however, was actually Dowsing Shaman+Seal of Fire.

The Majoroty of my games started off like this:

1st Turn: Mountain, Seal of Fire
2nd Turn: Forest, Fire off seal for 2, Summon Mauler

I had a BLAST playing this deck, it's surprisingly stable (when i'm not getting Land-Screwed, but that's due to my not shuffling well.)

any ideas, comments, or fixes?

-T/K

[Ordyh]

no <3 for Giant Solifuge

[TenteiKarite]

no <3 for Giant Solifuge
sure. let me put a creature who, by its very nature, makes ALL of my Auras Useless, not to mention the Wildsizes too...

IF I were going a more Expensive, and Burn Spell and Big Creature Route, then Yes, Solifuges would be MEAN beaters, but I've got PLaxes to make Better things untargetable.

-T/K

[YCBurninator]

TenteiKarite: Just so you know, the example that you described with the Skarrgan Skybreaker doesn't entirely work as you described it. You mentioned sacrificing the Skybreaker for 12, then sacrificing the coil to get a 6/6, however this doesn't work. Sacrificing the Skybreaker would be part of the cost of activating the ability, so when you activate it, it would sac the Skybreaker (setting 12 as the amount to be dealt) and all enchantments that were on it would automatically be put into the graveyard due to state-based effects before you could make a wurm. You would either have to make a wurm first and sac the Skybreaker for 6, or sac it for 12 and not get a wurm.

[TenteiKarite]

TenteiKarite: Just so you know, the example that you described with the Skarrgan Skybreaker doesn't entirely work as you described it. You mentioned sacrificing the Skybreaker for 12, then sacrificing the coil to get a 6/6, however this doesn't work. Sacrificing the Skybreaker would be part of the cost of activating the ability, so when you activate it, it would sac the Skybreaker (setting 12 as the amount to be dealt) and all enchantments that were on it would automatically be put into the graveyard due to state-based effects before you could make a wurm. You would either have to make a wurm first and sac the Skybreaker for 6, or sac it for 12 and not get a wurm.
no. I can Sac the Skybreaker in RESPONSE to sacing the Coil, the effects would go off backwards, Skybreaker Blasting for 12, and the wurm, before being sent to the GY, would be sacrificed to net me a 6/6 Wurm Token.

-T/K

[Rocko]

IMO you need 4 Dryad girls. Everybody and their mother runs nonbasic lands so she will be sure to get out at least 2 damage, which will help with the bloodthirst.

Also, instead of Skybreaker try Borborygmos.

[TenteiKarite]

IMO you need 4 Dryad girls. Everybody and their mother runs nonbasic lands so she will be sure to get out at least 2 damage, which will help with the bloodthirst.

Also, instead of Skybreaker try Borb****mos.
Pit-Skulks Get more than 2 Damage in consistantly, and for G, so I'm good there.

Neh. BorBor's Kewl, but Skybreaker's Gamebreaking. I MAY side BorBor tho...He could be Serious Fun, if I'm facing off against an Ivory Mask/Etc...

-T/K

[Rocko]

Cool. I've never been able to bring out either of them but Borbor looks cooler ^.^

[TenteiKarite]

Cool. I've never been able to bring out either of them but Borbor looks cooler ^.^

I like the Flavor Text, and Versatility of Skybreaker...although that Double Red in his mana cost screws me over occasionally...

-T/K

[YCBurninator]

no. I can Sac the Skybreaker in RESPONSE to sacing the Coil, the effects would go off backwards, Skybreaker Blasting for 12, and the wurm, before being sent to the GY, would be sacrificed to net me a 6/6 Wurm Token.

-T/K

If you sac the coil first, the Skybreaker IMMEDIATELY becomes a 6/6 (as the sacrificing of the coil is part of the activation), so even if you sacrifice the Skybreaker in response the coil sacrifice, it would still only do 6 because the coil would no longer be there.

[TenteiKarite]

If you sac the coil first, the Skybreaker IMMEDIATELY becomes a 6/6 (as the sacrificing of the coil is part of the activation), so even if you sacrifice the Skybreaker in response the coil sacrifice, it would still only do 6 because the coil would no longer be there.
but the thing is that Skybreaker's Effect activates before the Sacrificing occurs, STILL dealing 12, and then As the fling effect is resolving, Coil Sacrifices itself, and creates a 6/6 Green Wurm Creature token.

-T/K

[YCBurninator]

but the thing is that Skybreaker's Effect activates before the Sacrificing occurs, STILL dealing 12, and then As the fling effect is resolving, Coil Sacrifices itself, and creates a 6/6 Green Wurm Creature token.

-T/K

You can't respond in the middle of resolution. There are two ways you can really do the activations:

1) -Pay GGG and sacrifice the coil to put its effect on the stack.
-Respond to the coil by paying 1 and sacrificing the Skybreaker.
-Allow to resolve, dealing 6 damage from the Skybreaker and put a wurm into play

2) -Pay 1 and sacrifice the Skybreaker to put its ability on the stack.
-The coil goes to the graveyard due to state-based effects (as there is no opportunity to respond and activate the coil after sacrificing the Skybreaker)
-Allow to resolve, dealing 12 damage and having no wurm.

[Hate_4Ever]

Hey guys .. im just wondering .. what IS a Burning-Tree Shaman?

[ShroomXIII]

Hey guys .. im just wondering .. what IS a Burning-Tree Shaman?

burning-tree shaman
cost - 1/g/r
power 3/toughness 4
ability - when a player uses an activated ability that is not a mana ability that player loses 1 life

[Cheesemonger]

low already in play), Sac off Seal of Fire, Summon Skarrgan Skybreaker, end.
Next Turn, I play a Mana down, Hook Skybreaker up with a Wurmweaver Coil, Swing for 12/12 Tramplingageness, Sac off to blast another 12 at the opp's face, and sac off the Coil while it's on the stack, to get a 6/6 Wurm (with trample from the Plow) If they didn't die from the Skybreaker, they'll die next turn, when I Dowsing Shaman the Coil Back, and hook the token up to it for anothjer round of butt-whooping.

-T/K

I don't think that quite works. You sac the Skbreaker. Skybreaker goes to the graveyard as part of the cost, so you can't respond to that. SBE see a floating wurmweaver, and send it to the graveyard. The Skbreakers ability uses last known information, and deals 12. That's how I should think it ould work. Or you could Sac the Wurmweaver, then sac the Skybreaker. Get a 6/6 out, and deal 6.

going through the deck< i'd probably do something like this:

7 Forest
8 Mountains
4 Stomping Grounds
2 Skargg

4 Kird ape
4 Scab-Clan Mauler
4 Burning Tree shaman
3 Solifuge
3 Rumbling Slum
4 Skargan Pit Skulk
4 Drad Sophisticate

4 Moldervine Cloak
3 Flames of the Blood hand
3 Seal of Fire
3 Char


While certainly much more expensive (the Shamans alone are 10 dollars, or so. each) it isn't bad.

Moldervine Cloak > magemarks. the Cloak allows ou to dredge it back up, lest you get wrath of God'ed, or any other mass removal spell. It also turns anything and everything into a much larger beater, and makes most of your creatures dodge most removal, mass or targetted. The magemarks don't do that unless you get multiples into play. And if one of those is destroyed, you ain't getting back unless with Drowsing Shaman.

Skarggan Skybreaker seems like a bad idea. 6 mana is not a good thing in Aggro. 6 mana for a 3/3 that's only sometimes a 6/6, with a hard casting cost (though not too hard, considering that you should have 1 forest and 2 mountains by turn 6) is definatly not great.

Slum, and Solifuges are great. Solifuges maybe a little more so. Swings for 4 on turn 4, and dodges ALL targetted removal. Not putting an aura on it doesn't matter as much as you'd think. Just think of it as an easier to cast Char without the drawback of losing 2 life, but with an opponents choice instead.

Yamabushi's flame or Volcanic Hammer is decent, and an ok replacement for some of the more expensive burn (really just char...) Emperor Crocodile and Iwamori can replace the Slum/Solifuge if you can't afford them (The croc and iwamori aren't too expensive, to my knowledge). Burning tree Shaman is great, and I encourage you to try and get 4 of them. Some somewhat cheaper options include Loaming Shaman (screws up graveyard stuff, as in reanimation, Firemane Control, etc),and Isao (screws up most decks running blue, and regenerates). Neither are as great, but both should be somewhat cheaper, and are better in some situations.

[TenteiKarite]

going through the deck< i'd probably do something like this:


okay, you're obviously literate, considering the fact that you're typing.

Does that make you inattentive or stupid?

you suggested a deck full of stuff that I ALREADY SAID I CAN'T AFFORD.

-T/K

[Cheesemonger]

Yamabushi's flame or Volcanic Hammer is decent, and an ok replacement for some of the more expensive burn (really just char...) Emperor Crocodile and Iwamori can replace the Slum/Solifuge if you can't afford them (The croc and iwamori aren't too expensive, to my knowledge). Burning tree Shaman is great, and I encourage you to try and get 4 of them. Some somewhat cheaper options include Loaming Shaman (screws up graveyard stuff, as in reanimation, Firemane Control, etc),and Isao (screws up most decks running blue, and regenerates). Neither are as great, but both should be somewhat cheaper, and are better in some situations.

Will you look at that? Somehow, for some reason, there seems to be a section later on that gives you ideas on how to improve the deck while still remaining relatively cheap. Might I suggest that you should practice what you preach?

(Note: All of these are in USD)
Isao: .95
Iwamori: 1.99
Emperor Crocodile (9th edition): .38
Loaming Shaman: 1.49
Yamabushi's Flame: .04
Volcanic hammer (9th Edition): .15

Source: findmagiccards.com

Most of these cost less than a dollar, with the only exceptions being the Loaming Shaman, and Iwamori, which both cost less than 2 dollars.

If you'd be so kind to read my post fully next time, I'm sure everything will go a lot easier.

[Convinced]

Personally I prefer the Sophisticate over Skarrgan Pit-Skulk. I'm sure it has it's moments where it just outshines the Sophisticate with the ability to not be blocked by anything lower than it, but in many cases a free 2 damage is much better than a 1/1. (A good percent of the time it's a 1/1, unless you Seal of Fire for 2, or use the Shaman on turn 4-5.)

Not to mention the fact that almost EVERY deck in the current metagame runs non-basic lands. Give or take budget decks or mono color, every deck is running some sort of dual or pain.

Slap some enchantments on the Sophisticate and now URWildfireTron has to fetch a Wildfire/answer, GhostHusk has to haunt it or find an answer, W/X has to fetch a Wrath, Condem, or a general answer. Basically, it's pressure that the Skulk could not provide.

But to each his own.

[TenteiKarite]

okay, I made some MAJOR Tweaks to the design.

It's gonna take a while to do, But I can Pull this build off.

I've noticed though that I have 8 total cards with activated abilities, and 4 Burning-Tree Shaman. this worries me slightly... I'll still have to playtest it out, though...

Anybody have any more Ideas?

-T/K

[sainkaa]

okay, I made some MAJOR Tweaks to the design.

It's gonna take a while to do, But I can Pull this build off.

I've noticed though that I have 8 total cards with activated abilities, and 4 Burning-Tree Shaman. this worries me slightly... I'll still have to playtest it out, though...

Anybody have any more Ideas?

-T/K


key = dont use activated abilitys...


run 2-4 dyrads
4 kird ape
4 scab clan
4 giant solifuge
4 rumbling slum
4 burning trees..
only activates ablilitys iw ould run would be birds/elves.. but not really needed

[TenteiKarite]

key = dont use activated abilitys...

you DO realize that I'm speaking mostly aboutthe Seals of Fire, right?
I mean, other than that, I've got 2 Plows (which will probably never be turned into Creatures) 2 Dowsing Shamans, and a Wurmweaver Coil.

Dowsing Shamans are necessary for what I'm trying to do with my spell lineup, but they conflict with the Burning-Tree Shaman. I may have to rethink my SPell Lineup, but that's not something that's gonna happen today.

-T/K

Additional Comment:
it's been a While, so I thought I'd make some tweaks to the ol' Gruul Deck.

What do you guys think of it now?

-T/K