I want Cyber-Stein banned!!!! You hear that Kevin!?!?

[KJFJustice]

Anybody else have this problem or want this card banned?

Tonight I planned in a tourney and made it to Semi-Finals. I only lost 1 duel in the first 4 matches before playing the 5th. At one point during the first 4 I was down 100-8000 to a dark magician deck. I came back and won that duel. Later I played a guy who used Summoner of Illusions to Get Cyber End. He Limitered it and hit an Ojama Trio token for 7000 damage. Then he Mystic Wok'd the Cyber End!!! LPs were 700-12,600. I came back and won that duel.

Then in the 5th duel I played this kid I never played before. On the 2nd turn of both duels, he used field clearers, then used Yata, I mean Cyber-Stein to get Cyber Twin and get the win.

It really deflates the hell out of you when you work your pants off to get to semi's and then get worked over by one stupid, moronic, bogus, bloodless, heartless, gutless, monkey-faced, piece of doo-doo card. Holy Moly. Where's the Tylenol.

If you can do anything about it Kevin, get that thing banned for 6 months would ya?

EEDDIITT------------
Here is my 2nd post for those of you who have criticized me but were to lazy to read the entire thread.
Ok, let me clarify my initial post on this rotten card. I didn't just lose to this card once. I've lost to it a number of times and to some 4 different duelists now.

To me this card is the same as Yata. It's a card that has drawbacks, but if you wait and use it at the right time, that's game. For example: Yata's drawbacks are that it only has 200 attack points, makes you use your normal summon to get it on the field, and could potentially leave you with a clear field when it returns to the hand. That's pretty dangerous, but that didn't stop anyone from waiting to use it until their opponent's hands were empty, and theny creating a Yata lock, right?

Well Cyber-stein's disadvantages are that it costs 5000 lifepoints. Big deal. Most duelists I've seen use cards like Spell Absorption or Poison of the Old Man to keep their life points high. That gives them extra time to get and use Stein. And they don't just plop it down on the field as soon as they grab it. They wait until they can win with it.

Hell, just Stein and Cyber Twin by itself with a clear hit (the same as you need with Yata) is 6300 damage. Although you might be able to initally stop Stein by lowering their life points by 3000 (or more), they only need to lower yours by 1700 first to win with it. Add 1 equip card or another monster via special summon and that's most all the way to 8000.

Cyber-Stein is just as easy to use as Yata and most duelists I see know how to wait for the right time to use it, the same as with Yata. That's why I think it should be banned the same as Yata.

Is that a better argument everyone?

[DMOC2826]

Cyber Stein is certainly a cheap way to win, bu the cost is enormous, so focus on lowering your opponent's LP to below 5000 and side deck cards that stop stein, and field clearers
Magic Drain
Chain Disappearance
Magic Jammer

[Konoichi]

Well, they banned Makyura for the OTK...



So I guess it's not too farfetched.

[Ordyh]

Well, they banned Makyura for the OTK...



So I guess it's not too farfetched.
yes thats true, but its easier to counter the Stein-OTK. I do see a limit of cyber stein, but a ban is almost never gonna happen =\

[KJFJustice]

ya, 2nd duel I played to put a lot of cards down earlier to get ahead quick, but I didn't draw any of the 3 solemn's I sided-in. oh well.

[Konoichi]

yes thats true, but its easier to counter the Stein-OTK. I do see a limit of cyber stein, but a ban is almost never gonna happen =\

It is...? I'd personally find Chick a lot easier. ;x

[AnubisEX13]

stein isnt going to get banned let alone restricted due to the fact that no matter what you have to pay 5000 LP just to get something out.

that alone is a high price to pay no matter how you cut it.besides if you miss with steins hit your gonna get screwed hard on the next turn.

[kEviN21]

I honestly would see it restricted to 2....theres no reason to banned it nor restrict it to one

[CHaOsYaTa]

You weren't ready to face cyber stein otk,your fault.So don't whine here saying you want it banned.

[YGO_Master]

Anybody else have this problem or want this card banned?

Tonight I planned in a tourney and made it to Semi-Finals. I only lost 1 duel in the first 4 matches before playing the 5th. At one point during the first 4 I was down 100-8000 to a dark magician deck. I came back and won that duel. Later I played a guy who used Summoner of Illusions to Get Cyber End. He Limitered it and hit an Ojama Trio token for 7000 damage. Then he Mystic Wok'd the Cyber End!!! LPs were 700-12,600. I came back and won that duel.

Then in the 5th duel I played this kid I never played before. On the 2nd turn of both duels, he used field clearers, then used Yata, I mean Cyber-Stein to get Cyber Twin and get the win.

It really deflates the hell out of you when you work your pants off to get to semi's and then get worked over by one stupid, moronic, bogus, bloodless, heartless, gutless, monkey-faced, piece of doo-doo card. Holy Moly. Where's the Tylenol.

If you can do anything about it Kevin, get that thing banned for 6 months would ya?

thats alittle sad dude......that you want a card ban just casue you lost to it...get over it and move it...next time set your side deck up for it... hope you learned something, you can't win them all. :)

[Pharaoh Atem]

It is...? I'd personally find Chick a lot easier. ;x

The TRUE FTK spits in your face for that remark.

You TCGers had better be happy that you'll never see it - ever.

Do you know why?

It'd quite literally put any "broken" deck of your past and make it look like ****.

[King Zulu]

The TRUE FTK spits in your face for that remark.

You TCGers had better be happy that you'll never see it - ever.

Do you know why?

It'd quite literally put any "broken" deck of your past and make it look like ****.

Haha, you just gotta love Atem's posts. :p Honestly, I don't find CyberOTK decks that big a deal, their not like the previous formats mill decks. Now -those- were vicous. I play CyberOTK every now and then, and even though it may look like it's broken once you get owned by it, the same deck can roll over and die in another duel - consistency is the key.

Who knows, he might get banned. I wouldn't really care, I mean mill was my favourite decktype and I was kinda sad they killed it (or did they? fufufu...), but life goes on.

[DMOC2826]

What separates Cyber Stein OTKs from other OTK IMO is the fact that you have to attack whereas other OTKs you don't have to attack to win, and the cost isn't so great in contrast with Stein.
Really IMO you only need 1 Stein in your deck b/c it is searchable and can come out with Last Will of course.

[Lord of the Bling]

Why don't people side Threatening Roar/Waboku anymore?

[Kameiko]

Why don't people side Threatening Roar/Waboku anymore?

I main deck Waboku. their good commons.

[Upsidedownwurld]

What pisses me off is when some one tells me to take out waboku for sakeretsu. Waboku is Chianable and it ends a whole turn of damage.

[King Zulu]

What pisses me off is when some one tells me to take out waboku for sakeretsu. Waboku is Chianable and it ends a whole turn of damage.

Saku's, however kill of the monster, thus netting you a 1 for 1 trade. Waboku IS however nice sidedeck material.

[InteRab]

I have Cyber-stein in a few of my decks for that reason, I don't use him often but it's funny to see my opponent almost cry after they have field advantage, then i Dark Hole-Cyber-stein-Cyber Twin-GG

[mr hutton]

if they were gonna ban cyber stein because of the OTK theld also have to ban

last turn
rescue cat
exodia
ben kei

and that would just be silly

[Romancer]

Let's see. A 1 to 2 card 1TK. OH YEAH!!! It will be limited and or banned in the future. How soon simply depends on how much it is abused. If only a few people abuse it, it will continue to be an annoyance to the players who face it, but if it goes to top 8 or everyone and their grandmas start running it, it will be gone the next cycle.

[Daedalus]

the reason stein was un-restricted in japan was because of ring of destruction. now that ring is banned, you probably will see more of these cards pop up, but no one will use this card in 3's unless it is a deck based on it.
this card is still not the best. you have to pay 5000 to use a fusion monster that could have UP to 4500 atk. the only time this will help is if your opponent is already winning. i do not think this card is that good, but for side deck.

[Darth Payne]

Why should a card get banned just because 1 person lost to it once?

[Romancer]

the reason stein was un-restricted in japan was because of ring of destruction. now that ring is banned, you probably will see more of these cards pop up, but no one will use this card in 3's unless it is a deck based on it.
this card is still not the best. you have to pay 5000 to use a fusion monster that could have UP to 4500 atk. the only time this will help is if your opponent is already winning. i do not think this card is that good, but for side deck.
You can summon BEUD, Cyber End Dragon, Cyber Twin Dragon, and Master of OZ with a Cyber Stein. All huge monsters.

At the same time, you could run 1 Limiter Removal and 3 copies of Megamorph in your deck. which makes all the above into 1TK monsters.

Add 3 Mystic Woks incase you cannot clear the field before summoning the monster, or you can't pull off the 1TK, and you can essentially break even and try again later.

So, you have 3 Cyber Steins + 1 Sangan + 3 Mystic Tomatos + 3 Last Wills + Mass field clearers + 3 Megamorph + 1 Limiter Removal + 3 Mystic Woks... Yeah, there is defiantely a deck there. Numerous chances to do a 1TK on turn 2 with a minimum of 2 cards is just 1 tier of brokenness below CED and Yata.

[Daedalus]

You can summon BEUD, Cyber End Dragon, Cyber Twin Dragon, and Master of OZ with a Cyber Stein. All huge monsters.

At the same time, you could run 1 Limiter Removal and 3 copies of Megamorph in your deck. which makes all the above into 1TK monsters.

Add 3 Mystic Woks incase you cannot clear the field before summoning the monster, or you can't pull off the 1TK, and you can essentially break even and try again later.

So, you have 3 Cyber Steins + 1 Sangan + 3 Mystic Tomatos + 3 Last Wills + Mass field clearers + 3 Megamorph + 1 Limiter Removal + 3 Mystic Woks... Yeah, there is defiantely a deck there. Numerous chances to do a 1TK on turn 2 with a minimum of 2 cards is just 1 tier of brokenness below CED and Yata.

like i said, "unless a deck is specifically runs around the card."

[plumaglob63]

otk arent hard to stop
there only hard if u cant do ne thing to stop it
ex. scientist otk (banned)

[The Punisher]

"I want Cyber Stein banned because I got beat by it!"

Doesn't sound any different from "I want Pot unbanned because I like to play the card!" True arguments? Evidence that the lame thing is wreaking the metagame? Nah, none of that.

[SaintDragon7777]

Cyber stein is cheap. I too would like it to be banned. Unlike exodia and last turn decks stein can be put many deck just to get lucky once in a while. Stien doesn't really need limiter and megamorph to work. find a cooky deck take a monster out add a stein and it still works.

I understadn stiens can be countered but it is really annoying.

[hmk17]

The only OTK's that are going to be banned are the ones that do not allow for few if any actions on the part of your opponent.

Makyura based Exchange of the Spirit decks were brutal as you could ask your opponent, "do you have it?". And that was generally the game. Scientist/Turtle was the same way.

I played the OTK back when it was only BEUD and Cyberstein. I played against it, and that was with Harpies, Raigeki, and most everything legal. Then there were only 5 counters to the attack. Mirror Force, Ring of Destruction, Widespread Ruin, Waboku, and Kuriboh... Nobody really ran Waboku or Kuiboh, either. Odds are you only had 1-3 counters in any given deck. That was broken... and many players simply didn't like you for it, especially younger ones. Then more things came out that pushed the deck into hibernation because they completely wrecked it.

This format has more available to counter and this deck type is not even close to being the strongest possible. Trust me, the card will not be banned nor does it even deserve consideration. Instead of wanting a ban on it, petition Ring of Destruction come off.

[Paladinseer007]

Cyber Stein is certainly a cheap way to win, bu the cost is enormous, so focus on lowering your opponent's LP to below 5000 and side deck cards that stop stein, and field clearers
Magic Drain
Chain Disappearance
Magic Jammer

I agree, yes it does have a high price to bring out a fusion monster and all.But I'm having a hard time seeing the possibility of cyber stein being banned.

[Shadow of Death]

It's great watching people complain to get cards ban because they lose to them. Same thing happened to people when scientist FTK came out, so what did any intelligent person do? Side against it (3x King Tiger Wanghu, 3x Barrel Behind the Door, 3x Prohibition, Ceasefire, Torrential Tribute, Enemy Controller, etc, and we have Des Wombat, Hallowed Life Barrier, etc now if it ever came back). The same can be done with Cyber Steins. Just side deck cards that will A) negate the attack, b) negate field clearers (Magic Drain, Magic Jammer, Judgment of Anubis), C) massive aggro burn to put them under 5000 (maybe lower if they run mystic wok). Most OTKs can be countered some how.

[Indignation]

Why should a card get banned just because 1 person lost to it once?
"Quoted for emphasis"

Seriously guys you are all complaining over a card that is easily beaten and even in its own deck is not successful enough to become tier 1 material. Let it stay we need some random OTK decks.

[Romancer]

It's great watching people complain to get cards ban because they lose to them. Same thing happened to people when scientist FTK came out, so what did any intelligent person do? Side against it (3x King Tiger Wanghu, 3x Barrel Behind the Door, 3x Prohibition, Ceasefire, Torrential Tribute, Enemy Controller, etc, and we have Des Wombat, Hallowed Life Barrier, etc now if it ever came back). The same can be done with Cyber Steins. Just side deck cards that will A) negate the attack, b) negate field clearers (Magic Drain, Magic Jammer, Judgment of Anubis), C) massive aggro burn to put them under 5000 (maybe lower if they run mystic wok). Most OTKs can be countered some how.
Isn't Scientist FTK sort of in its own category of brokenness from most other 1TK decks? You can side in 15 cards of counters to the deck, but on turn 1, if you go second, you have a 0% chance to stop the combo from going off. If an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure, then a deck full of tech against Scientist FTK is like a stockpile of prevention when you're already sick with the disease, and you just don't know it.

[PainAgonySuffering]

Well UDE missed one, ok? Still as long as they release cards I'm sure there will always be a OTK deck. They just got rid of the sickest OTK of all-time. Which was the Scientist OTK. Not just that imagine the Serpentine Princess combo with Fiber Jar. Just some sick stuff.

[Witecat]

One Turn Kills are notoriously hard to stop, but the Cyberstien version can be prevented if you take the time to figure out the weaknesses of the deck (IE: Kuriboh is your best defense!). Still, calling for a ban because you lost to it makes you sound like a whiney little punk. Suck it up and build a deck that can stop it!

[Frodo420]

so why isn't cyber stein restricted. It just makes it easier to win with. and if you play your cyber steins right, you'll be unstopable.

[Indignation]

Even when played right they are not unstoppable. If they were unstopable we would see them in top 8 every SJC.

[Paladinseer007]

so why isn't cyber stein restricted. It just makes it easier to win with. and if you play your cyber steins right, you'll be unstopable.

That's true, I do agree that Cyber-stein should be restricted, even though a person would have a way to rebuild their life points after they pay for it's effect they would still get an easy win in a duel. :D

[mr hutton]

guys whats the big whoop its cyber stein

all thats happened is someone built a deck which abuses it and it worked
i mean honestly it makes a nice change to playing against aggro and CC

[Warakia]

We've had Devil Franken (Cyber Stein) for years in the Japanese game, and well although the Franken TKO decks have always existed they were never very dominant, at least to the point of restricting or to the grand extent of banning Franken.

Its an ok deck, that when used right can be playable.

We need more of these in our meta actually.

I see no reason to hinder a common combo that can be easily thrown off kilter with a merely 3000 points of damage. With all of the aggro decks out there stopping your opponent short lp wise shouldn't be too hard now should it?

[TopDecking Samurai]

Its a cheap win and takes no skill to run that OTK deck but if you side deck right is no problem at all, no need to ban the stupid card only nOObs and sorry people will use it anyways!

[mr hutton]

Its a cheap win and takes no skill to run that OTK deck but if you side deck right is no problem at all, no need to ban the stupid card only nOObs and sorry people will use it anyways!

so it takes no skill to run a combo deck huh
il have to remember that one

i mean it never occured to me that true players of the game ignore obvious ways to abuse card effects and instead choose the obvious route of simply hitting the opponent with attack cards

[x TaCo x]

he could possibly be restricted to 2, but still its 5000 lps jsut to use his effect, hes and easy card to sidedeck against so you jsut pay smart.

[HolyDraconus]

so it takes no skill to run a combo deck huh
il have to remember that one

i mean it never occured to me that true players of the game ignore obvious ways to abuse card effects and instead choose the obvious route of simply hitting the opponent with attack cards

........... Agreed. Cyber Stein banned?! Ha! Really though, it seems stupid to ban it. To be honest, Cyber Stein sits right next to Skill Drain decks in terms of could of beens. A subpar card by itself plus other subpar cards used in combinations can create a winning combination...But just as easily it can be dismantled. Think about it.... SD was hyped for awhile as the next big thing... yet to see it win though. I ran against a SD at the height of its hype. My old pal Relequished won the day for me. I fought two Cyber Stein decks best two of three... Relequished made sure those two players won't try that again. It just depends on YOU. Use your side board. It is there for a reason. You lost? Pick yourself up and try again. You think this card should be banned? tell you what.. If this card is featured in 8 of the top ten decks of the world, then maybe, just maybe, someone in a position to do something about it may pay more attention to it. But as it stands..... Not today, or tomorrow, or April, for that matter..... But eh, thats just my two cents....

[Konoichi]

so it takes no skill to run a combo deck huh
il have to remember that one

i mean it never occured to me that true players of the game ignore obvious ways to abuse card effects and instead choose the obvious route of simply hitting the opponent with attack cards


My intelligence dropped reading that.



Anyway, it really should be banned. Not because it's broken, per se, but I just think OTKs really have no place in a game where tiebreakers are playing such a big role in tournaments.

I mean, some guy comes into an SJC and rips off some lucky ones on you ("But you should side deck for it!!!" Like you draw it every time? Come on), and you take a loss. Then he gets bad draws because of the possible inconsistant performance of OTK decks, and your tiebreaker is horrible.

So yeah, I personally would want to rid the game of most of these specific combo OTK decks ("But any deck can be a OTK, look at Chaos!!!" Don't be stupid, you know what I mean). They screw up things more than they help.

[UCCK91]

Well, they banned Makyura for the OTK...



So I guess it's not too farfetched.


CS is not that great of a card.... It takes skill to use him and it's not a for sure way to win. 5000 life is alot. And the creature is only alive for one turn. So in a sense it's an 0-1.

[Nyan_Nyanfan22]

You learn more from a loss, then you do from a victory. Complaining about wanting a card banned, because you lost to it, is not the way to go. I have been struggling against my brother, for a while now. He used to beat me 2-0, every duel. Now, I've been losing only 2-1. This shows my deck building skills are getting better. (And believe me, they aren't that good). Don't let a loss get you down, just learn from it.

[KogyochiBJ]

Well, they banned Makyura for the OTK...



So I guess it's not too farfetched.

Yeah, Cyber Stein is like 1054% easier to pull of than that redicuously stupid and impossible makyura combo. They really should take a look at limiting it for the next list.

by the way, I faced a full out Cyber Stein OTK at the last regional I was in, that ******* killed me in the second turn 2nd game, and almost killed me in the 3rd game. You just have to TRY to bull rush that sort of deck, it's just soo cheap.


UCCK91-The monster stays on the field until destroyed with cyber stein.

[Blankauctions]

let see.. Half your life points gone and BEUD doesn't even have an effect that negates spells or traps... take into account, Cyber Stein has a pitiful attack. BEUD can get removed by many cards (Widespread/Sakuretsu/Fissure/ Dark Hole/Enemy Controller/Smashing Grounds)..
It could use a limiting of 2... but you know, it's not hard to defend against BEUD.

[II Shinobi II]

yes thats true, but its easier to counter the Stein-OTK. I do see a limit of cyber stein, but a ban is almost never gonna happen =\

Stein is also very inconsistint...... And ifyou have a nice sidedeck. Stein is horrible. I used the FTK stein for a while and see no reason for it to be banned. Unless he unban draw power. (Stein Decks are a four card combo....)

[Blankauctions]

the worst crime is that Cyber Stein is more pricey than BEUD

[KJFJustice]

Ok, let me clarify my initial post on this rotten card. I didn't just lose to this card once. I've lost to it a number of times and to some 4 different duelists now.

To me this card is the same as Yata. It's a card that has drawbacks, but if you wait and use it at the right time, that's game. For example: Yata's drawbacks are that it only has 200 attack points, makes you use your normal summon to get it on the field, and could potentially leave you with a clear field when it returns to the hand. That's pretty dangerous, but that didn't stop anyone from waiting to use it until their opponent's hands were empty, and theny creating a Yata lock, right?

Well Cyber-stein's disadvantages are that it costs 5000 lifepoints. Big deal. Most duelists I've seen use cards like Spell Absorption or Poison of the Old Man to keep their life points high. That gives them extra time to get and use Stein. And they don't just plop it down on the field as soon as they grab it. They wait until they can win with it.

Hell, just Stein and Cyber Twin by itself with a clear hit (the same as you need with Yata) is 6300 damage. Although you might be able to initally stop Stein by lowering their life points by 3000 (or more), they only need to lower yours by 1700 first to win with it. Add 1 equip card or another monster via special summon and that's most all the way to 8000.

Cyber-Stein is just as easy to use as Yata and most duelists I see know how to wait for the right time to use it, the same as with Yata. That's why I think it should be banned the same as Yata.

Is that a better argument everyone?

[mightymage]

If that's what you keep losing to than sidedeck for it. I find Cyber Jar is particularly mean when facing a Cyber Stein Deck. Hell, there's plenty of stuff that will ruin the combo really. Solemn Judgements, Waboku's, Spirit Reaper will stop CTD.

[Jonny]

Alot of ppl lose to Stein decks, are they complaining about banning it? No. Please stop your nonsense of banning Stein, improve your deck and go find ways to slaughter it. End of discussion. :/

[HolyDraconus]

Ok, let me clarify my initial post on this rotten card. I didn't just lose to this card once. I've lost to it a number of times and to some 4 different duelists now.

To me this card is the same as Yata. It's a card that has drawbacks, but if you wait and use it at the right time, that's game. For example: Yata's drawbacks are that it only has 200 attack points, makes you use your normal summon to get it on the field, and could potentially leave you with a clear field when it returns to the hand. That's pretty dangerous, but that didn't stop anyone from waiting to use it until their opponent's hands were empty, and theny creating a Yata lock, right?

Well Cyber-stein's disadvantages are that it costs 5000 lifepoints. Big deal. Most duelists I've seen use cards like Spell Absorption or Poison of the Old Man to keep their life points high. That gives them extra time to get and use Stein. And they don't just plop it down on the field as soon as they grab it. They wait until they can win with it.

Hell, just Stein and Cyber Twin by itself with a clear hit (the same as you need with Yata) is 6300 damage. Although you might be able to initally stop Stein by lowering their life points by 3000 (or more), they only need to lower yours by 1700 first to win with it. Add 1 equip card or another monster via special summon and that's most all the way to 8000.

Cyber-Stein is just as easy to use as Yata and most duelists I see know how to wait for the right time to use it, the same as with Yata. That's why I think it should be banned the same as Yata.

Is that a better argument everyone?


One word: Nope. Oh, want me to go farther then? Sure. Cyber Stein is not that good as a OTK. There are better ones than him. You even said it yourself:people know how to wait. Apparantly, these duelists that you are facing know how to use their cards. Let me give an example to clarify things a bit.
There's an effect monster who has terrible attack and defense stats, but has the unique ablity of allowing you to pay 3000 life points to drop a fusion in the graveyard. There is also an equip spell card called Refusion, which allows you to bring back from the grave a fusion and equip it to that monster for 800 life points. For a total of 3800 life points, I can pull off the OTK that cyber stein does for 1200 less.The difference is two cards: Cyber uses less cards, but life points matter more to Cyber anyway. I mean, with that card, I can stall with MoP for 12 turns before havin to drop it.
Meh, he just isn't ban worthy, nor limited to 2. There has to be some really twisted combos to make him that and the OTK just don't cut it. This post is too long.....

[Nanya]

Cyber-Stein never has been, nor will be limited.

Compare it to Magical Scientist...

5,000 Life points is HELLVA lot more to pay than a mere 1,000.

With Scientist, you win with just 2 to 3 cards in your opening hand and nothing more, and you do it before your opponent goes.

With Cyber-Stein, you need (at least) four cards and your opponent can *still* stop the damage (Goats from before the Cyber-End Dragon), Kuriboh, Roar/Waboku, Winged Kuriboh.

While I did use the Cyber-Stein OTK deck for a short while on YVD, it's not all that good. Funner than hell when your opponent can't stop what you do. (Especially when you use a Master of Oz + Megamorph + Big Bang Shot)

Speaking of Megamorph...

Megamorph was limited to one because of the Cyber-Stein OTK.

Ban Dark Hole first, then talk about Cyber-Stein.

[Indignation]

CS OTK does not even compare to a MS OTK deck. MS OTK can win before you even start your first turn more than not. CS OTK can't.

MS=Banned for a reason
CS=not banned because it's not broken.

[TacoKing]

Mind Crush is another great anti-Cyber Stein card too, or even...Kuriboh!!! CS won't be banned, it's too situational and too easy to counter *by smart sidedeckers*

[Konoichi]

let see.. Half your life points gone and BEUD doesn't even have an effect that negates spells or traps... take into account, Cyber Stein has a pitiful attack. BEUD can get removed by many cards (Widespread/Sakuretsu/Fissure/ Dark Hole/Enemy Controller/Smashing Grounds)..
It could use a limiting of 2... but you know, it's not hard to defend against BEUD.

Tell me, what does that add to the topic? Maybe you don't know, but the OTK involves a card called Megamorph and (most always) Giant Trunade of something similar. Cyber Stein's attack has no importance when you're looking at a 9000 attacker right next to him. And the "no negation effect" reasoning has no importance because of the inclusion of the multiple m/t removers in the Cyber Stein OTK deck.

Also, of the cards you listed, Widespread, Sakuretsu, and Enemy Controller are all quelled by the m/t removers. Fissure, Dark Hole, and Smashing Ground can only be played on your turn, and it's already over by then.


Stein is also very inconsistint...... And ifyou have a nice sidedeck. Stein is horrible. I used the FTK stein for a while and see no reason for it to be banned. Unless he unban draw power. (Stein Decks are a four card combo....)

Your side deck still relies on luck of the draw. You can't dedicate too much of your side to it because there are other decks in the format that you look to counter. So of the cards you side in, you actually need to draw them AND get to use them without interruption (it's not like the Stein player's just gonna sit there). Why bother taking up spaces in the side deck and ruining tiebreakers because of dumb luck (as if there's not enough in this format), when you could just ban/restrict it and be done? It's not like Stein is being used anywhere else.


Alot of ppl lose to Stein decks, are they complaining about banning it? No. Please stop your nonsense of banning Stein, improve your deck and go find ways to slaughter it. End of discussion. :/

By that logic, we shouldn't even have a banned/restricted list. I mean, just go out and find a way to beat it, right? Think about that.


There's an effect monster who has terrible attack and defense stats, but has the unique ablity of allowing you to pay 3000 life points to drop a fusion in the graveyard. There is also an equip spell card called Refusion, which allows you to bring back from the grave a fusion and equip it to that monster for 800 life points. For a total of 3800 life points, I can pull off the OTK that cyber stein does for 1200 less.The difference is two cards: Cyber uses less cards, but life points matter more to Cyber anyway. I mean, with that card, I can stall with MoP for 12 turns before havin to drop it.

Life points hardly matter to Cyber. It has to get the job done quick, which is what the deck aims to do. If the game goes on too long, it doesn't matter how much LP the guy has, the probably won't be able to pull out a win.

And you example makes no sense. The combo you gave us is a TON worse than Stein, so all you did is make Stein look more restrictable. Oh, and when you said you could stal with MP for 12 turns, I think you meant 12 MORE turns. The Stein deck can already stall for 29 (uninterrupted) turns with MP, you telling me that's not enough?


Compare it to Magical Scientist...

5,000 Life points is HELLVA lot more to pay than a mere 1,000.

With Scientist, you win with just 2 to 3 cards in your opening hand and nothing more, and you do it before your opponent goes.

Wait... so you're comparing it to a card that got banned? BLS is pathetic in the shadow of CED, but it still got banned. Just because something could do it better doesn't mean Stein can't do it well enough to deserve a banning.


CS OTK does not even compare to a MS OTK deck. MS OTK can win before you even start your first turn more than not. CS OTK can't.

MS=Banned for a reason
CS=not banned because it's not broken.

See previous response.

Mind Crush is another great anti-Cyber Stein card too, or even...Kuriboh!!! CS won't be banned, it's too situational and too easy to counter *by smart sidedeckers*

Still gives you the dilemma of actually drawing them.

[austinzc3]

can anyone here see this card getting banned??????

I see it being limited in the near future just to level the playing field, but a ban, it's probible not in the cards.

[Romancer]

can anyone here see this card getting banned??????

I see it being limited in the near future just to level the playing field, but a ban, it's probible not in the cards.
Regardless of how people feel about the card, if it irritates enough people with its cheap wins, then it will be limited. If someone finds a way to consistantly brake it, then it will be banned. So, in other words, if you want it banned, then everyone needs to start picking up their Cyber Steins and run a Cyber Stein 2nd Turn Kill deck. That'll force Konami's hand.

As an extra bonus, it'd be nice to see all the pro elites with their near identical decks be slaughtered by a noob and their crappy Cyber Stein deck at SJC. Muwahahahaha...

[BigDaddySkeletor]

Anybody else have this problem or want this card banned?

Tonight I planned in a tourney and made it to Semi-Finals. I only lost 1 duel in the first 4 matches before playing the 5th. At one point during the first 4 I was down 100-8000 to a dark magician deck. I came back and won that duel. Later I played a guy who used Summoner of Illusions to Get Cyber End. He Limitered it and hit an Ojama Trio token for 7000 damage. Then he Mystic Wok'd the Cyber End!!! LPs were 700-12,600. I came back and won that duel.

Then in the 5th duel I played this kid I never played before. On the 2nd turn of both duels, he used field clearers, then used Yata, I mean Cyber-Stein to get Cyber Twin and get the win.

It really deflates the hell out of you when you work your pants off to get to semi's and then get worked over by one stupid, moronic, bogus, bloodless, heartless, gutless, monkey-faced, piece of doo-doo card. Holy Moly. Where's the Tylenol.

If you can do anything about it Kevin, get that thing banned for 6 months would ya?

And people in hell want Ice Water...

its not going to be banned.

[HolyDraconus]

Kuriboh. Waboku.Threatening Roar. Winged Kuriboh for that matter. Does any of these cards ring a bell for you? How about Hollowed Life Barrier? IT CAN BE COUNTERED. With ease as well, since the cards I listed are common for the most part. GT? Chain Waboku, Threatening Roar or Hollowed Life Barrier. DH? Hey look its Kuriboh and Friends!
Some people actually run them in threes. Especially fiend decks. Or better yet how about Magic Drain/Jammer to nix the GT or DH: which ever goes off first. Or if you REALLY wanna try something strange, use White Hole..... ok not white hole but the rest are valid.
SOI-JP057
Successful Rating 0%
Trap - Normal
Randomly send two Fusion monsters from opponent's Fusion deck to Graveyard.

Lets see. I run what? Two of these in my side deck and voila! No more Cyber Stien/BEUD!! Hell, I'll throw three in there just to make sure I hit them all. With BEUD out, the other fusions they would probably have would be CyberTwin, CyberEnd and that koala. But a lot of players ditched the koala for BEUD anyway. Hmmmm.
Peten the Dark Clown
Level: 3
Attribute: Dark
Type: Spellcaster
Atk/ 500
Def/ 1200
Effect: When this card is sent to your Graveyard, you can remove this card from the Graveyard to Special Summon 1 "Peten the Dark Clown" from your hand or Deck.
Oh look a counter to Cyber Stein!
EEN-EN052 Dark Deal/Normal Trap/You can only activate this card by paying 1000 Life Points when your opponent activates a Normal Spell Card. The effect of the Normal Spell Card that your opponent activated at that time becomes “Your opponent discards 1 random card from their hand”.
Well will you look at that... Yet ANOTHER way to counter that combo, and it ties great into darkworld themed decks.
Face it man: There has to be a HUGE surge in people using that combo for it to even be noticed, let alone restricted/ban/limited. As for the combo I posted, it was to show you that there are other ways to get the same effect, and with that I end now.

[soraokyut]

hpow about siding some wabokus instead of complaining. sheesh. seems like everytime someone loses to a combo or something they complain about getting the card banned. Why don't UDE and Konami just ban everything then everyone would be happy eh?

[Kameiko]

hpow about siding some wabokus instead of complaining. sheesh. seems like everytime someone loses to a combo or something they complain about getting the card banned. Why don't UDE and Konami just ban everything then everyone would be happy eh?

Nah, then people would complain about how their on the forbidden list, then when they take them off they'll complain more and want to put them back on.

[soraokyut]

Nah, then people would complain about how their on the forbidden list, then when they take them off they'll complain more and want to put them back on.

yeah that's true. can you think about the complaining if witch ever hit the limited list again. sheesh. we would have six months of excessive whining to deal with. ugh

[HolyDraconus]

yeah that's true. can you think about the complaining if witch ever hit the limited list again. sheesh. we would have six months of excessive whining to deal with. ugh
yep. people canfind somethin to complain about

[shnitzo]

now why cant you beat it is it because you didnt have the cards to counter it in your sidedeck or you didnt get to draw them fast enough? even so it is one deck it should be able to win(that is its purpose) its not hard to beat and no time in the future do i see it getting banned or even limited

[HolyDraconus]

I mean really. If everyone keeps this up then everytime something SEEMS strong will be nuked instantly (OMG!!! My opponent is running warriors!!! He's repeatedly using the Phoenix Blade!!! And puttin it on Geerfreid!!! OH NO!!! He's gonna activate RFtDD!!! ;p ). I believe you should run what you like. That's why I run Relequished Lockdown. But meh. I would say it, like shnitzo, but I think he has already made it clear...

[Ordyh]

HolyDraconus - how does Dark Deal counter Stein Otk?

[wingzero001]

Little Cry Baby!

[HolyDraconus]

HolyDraconus - how does Dark Deal counter Stein Otk?
they usually start by activatin DH or HS. By activatin Dark Deal, you made sure that one of those two ( unless you had two down there) isn't going off. On top of that, if you are runnin Dark World( and you would with this card) then you may get one of those monsters in the grave just to turn around and come back. But even if you don't run Dark World, you are still changin the text of one of the cards needed for the OTK, in your favor, by changin DH or HS into a backward Confiscation.... sorta. You still dont need to fear the card that you used it against for that turn, and unless they are runnin MoF, then it aint comin comin back anyway. Does that help?

[ownsyou]

I bet he's one of those people who complain about not enough original/different decks.

[KJFJustice]

I bet he's one of those people who complain about not enough original/different decks.

Really- don't stick your foot too far down your throat. I change my deck every single tournament. I never run the same deck twice because there are a few guys I play that are very good who work to memorize their opponent's decks. So I have to change it for them. I can run GK, GK Burn, Burn, Normal Monsters, Warrior, Chaos, Relinquished, Beast Piercing, Blue Eyes with Paladin, Dark Magician, and Machine. Next I'm going to add in an Ameba deck once the spellcaster structure comes out.

I change it all the time, so don't give me any bananas about original decks. I keep things fun for others by switching up my decks a lot. What I don't like is a one turn kill when I've got more than 6000 life points and the duel just started. There's not much point to dueling when you can just be sniped like that. That's the point of a ban list, to try and level the playing field for lots of decks and give everyone more of a fighting chance to play and survive.

OH YA- I edited my 1st post with my 2nd for those of you who commented on the 1st without seeing the 2nd. No searching required.

[HolyDraconus]

Kuriboh. Waboku.Threatening Roar. Winged Kuriboh for that matter. Does any of these cards ring a bell for you? How about Hollowed Life Barrier? IT CAN BE COUNTERED. With ease as well, since the cards I listed are common for the most part. GT? Chain Waboku, Threatening Roar or Hollowed Life Barrier. DH? Hey look its Kuriboh and Friends!
Some people actually run them in threes. Especially fiend decks. Or better yet how about Magic Drain/Jammer to nix the GT or DH: which ever goes off first. Or if you REALLY wanna try something strange, use White Hole..... ok not white hole but the rest are valid.
SOI-JP057
Successful Rating 0%
Trap - Normal
Randomly send two Fusion monsters from opponent's Fusion deck to Graveyard.

Lets see. I run what? Two of these in my side deck and voila! No more Cyber Stien/BEUD!! Hell, I'll throw three in there just to make sure I hit them all. With BEUD out, the other fusions they would probably have would be CyberTwin, CyberEnd and that koala. But a lot of players ditched the koala for BEUD anyway. Hmmmm.
Peten the Dark Clown
Level: 3
Attribute: Dark
Type: Spellcaster
Atk/ 500
Def/ 1200
Effect: When this card is sent to your Graveyard, you can remove this card from the Graveyard to Special Summon 1 "Peten the Dark Clown" from your hand or Deck.
Oh look a counter to Cyber Stein!
EEN-EN052 Dark Deal/Normal Trap/You can only activate this card by paying 1000 Life Points when your opponent activates a Normal Spell Card. The effect of the Normal Spell Card that your opponent activated at that time becomes “Your opponent discards 1 random card from their hand”.
Well will you look at that... Yet ANOTHER way to counter that combo, and it ties great into darkworld themed decks.
Face it man: There has to be a HUGE surge in people using that combo for it to even be noticed, let alone restricted/ban/limited. As for the combo I posted, it was to show you that there are other ways to get the same effect, and with that I end now.
You edited your post eh? But did you even look at this one? Doesn't this post by itself show you that Stein isn't as all powerful as you think he is? Doesn't it show that Stein is far weaker then you think? And before you post it: No, I don't pretend to know what you think, that's not my place in the world. But still, my post should of showed you that Stein's banning isn't going to happen unless at the next SJC everyone runs it. And I don't think they will.... But I could be wrong. Unlikely, yet possible.. meh

[KJFJustice]

You edited your post eh? But did you even look at this one? Doesn't this post by itself show you that Stein isn't as all powerful as you think he is? Doesn't it show that Stein is far weaker then you think? And before you post it: No, I don't pretend to know what you think, that's not my place in the world. But still, my post should of showed you that Stein's banning isn't going to happen unless at the next SJC everyone runs it. And I don't think they will.... But I could be wrong. Unlikely, yet possible.. meh

Yes I saw it. I ignored it b/c you ignored my post about how opponent's don't use Stein unless they KNOW they can hit for the win. No one just stupidly summons it to the field pays 5000 and gets a Cyber fusion, and then dumbly attacks face-down monsters with face-down M/T's on the field. They wait until the threats are removed with other cards first. So it doesn't matter what I side in.

However I usually side-in 3 Solemns though and other more chainable cards. I'm going to add Wabokus next. But it doesn't matter. In one duel I had 4 goats and a Don on the field with 1 Sakuretsu face-down, 2nd turn. You know what I got? MST on Sak, Cyber Dragon, Lightning Vortex, what do ya know, clear field, Stein, Cyber Twin, game.

And no a card doesn't get banned just b/c everyone uses it. There are a number of banned cards that rarely saw play. They are banned b/c in the right circumstance, they create massive one-sided advantage. (Or because Konami just wanted to alter the metagame a bit). Stein is still a 1 turn early game killer in the right circumstance and that's why I don't like it.

EDIT- I forgot- How does Dark Deal help? It turns an opponent's my opponent's normal spells into Confo's against me. That only helps if I'm running dark world.

[HolyDraconus]

Yes I saw it. I ignored it b/c you ignored my post about how opponent's don't use Stein unless they KNOW they can hit for the win. No one just stupidly summons it to the field pays 5000 and gets a Cyber fusion, and then dumbly attacks face-down monsters with face-down M/T's on the field. They wait until the threats are removed with other cards first. So it doesn't matter what I side in.

No I didn't ignore yours. And I even accepted that possibility in my post, hence the cards that can counter it. Peten works very well against them too.

However I usually side-in 3 Solemns though and other more chainable cards. I'm going to add Wabokus next. But it doesn't matter. In one duel I had 4 goats and a Don on the field with 1 Sakuretsu face-down, 2nd turn. You know what I got? MST on Sak, Cyber Dragon, Lightning Vortex, what do ya know, clear field, Stein, Cyber Twin, game.


.....sounds like you're complaining that you lost to me.

And no a card doesn't get banned just b/c everyone uses it. There are a number of banned cards that rarely saw play. They are banned b/c in the right circumstance, they create massive one-sided advantage. (Or because Konami just wanted to alter the metagame a bit). Stein is still a 1 turn early game killer in the right circumstance and that's why I don't like it.

I never said that was the only reason, now did I?

EDIT- I forgot- How does Dark Deal help? It turns an opponent's my opponent's normal spells into Confo's against me. That only helps if I'm running dark world.
Ok, let's look at this. Opponents only use it when they KNOW they will hit? They activate GT, oh wait magic jammer. Do the same to dark hole, Lightning Vortex or whatever. Oh, they have counter to that? Waboku, Threatening Roar will do as well. Oh wait they countered THAT? Kuriboh will STILL save you to beat them down for doing that. You got that?! You do realize how much they must extend to do that right?! It STILL SHOWS that the card isn't ban worthy. There is more than enough ways to counter it. Stein is still a 1 turn early game killer in the right circumstance and that's why I don't like it.
Let me highlight it for you...
in the right circumstance
You said it there... They have to have that right moment to drop the bomb on you, and by then it is usually too late... Not always, cause that would mean that the Stein deck never wins, but usually. Beatdown is a stein decks nightmare. The ability to drop an opponent by 5000 on the second turn makes sure that stein isn't winning at all. As for Dark Deal, apparently you didn't read my last post so let me dumb it down for you: If they activate Lightning Vortex, Giant Trunade, Heavy Storm, or Dark Hole, you activate this card. You have just saved your monsters/spells/traps for the price of 1000 life points and two cards. Will they still press the attack? Doubt it. Can you live with a 1000 less? Should.

[zero 117]

my strat is to use stein to summon beud then use megamorph

[Kopaka of Ice]

Cyber Stein will not be broken until Crush Card Virus aka Deck Destruction Virus is released in the US, even then it won't be too powerful...

The reason? Pay 5000, summon BEUD/Master of Oz/Cyber End Dragon then use Crush on Cyber Stein. Your opponent most likely will have a horrible time dealing with no 1500+ monsters and you can see what they were planning.

Otherwise, Cyber Stein is not very broken. It's a MASSIVE cost to summon a big, easily destroyed monster.

[zomgitsadrummer]

If it does get banned, I'd feel sorry for the person who bought one for $23k on eBay.

[Nanya]

It won't. Even at its hieght of play in Japan, it never got limited or even Semi-limited.

Megamorph felt the brunt of that problem being limited to one because of that. Course, we had Raigeki and Feather Duster at that time too...

[mr hutton]

Ok, let me clarify my initial post on this rotten card. I didn't just lose to this card once. I've lost to it a number of times and to some 4 different duelists now.

To me this card is the same as Yata. It's a card that has drawbacks, but if you wait and use it at the right time, that's game. For example: Yata's drawbacks are that it only has 200 attack points, makes you use your normal summon to get it on the field, and could potentially leave you with a clear field when it returns to the hand. That's pretty dangerous, but that didn't stop anyone from waiting to use it until their opponent's hands were empty, and theny creating a Yata lock, right?

Well Cyber-stein's disadvantages are that it costs 5000 lifepoints. Big deal. Most duelists I've seen use cards like Spell Absorption or Poison of the Old Man to keep their life points high. That gives them extra time to get and use Stein. And they don't just plop it down on the field as soon as they grab it. They wait until they can win with it.

Hell, just Stein and Cyber Twin by itself with a clear hit (the same as you need with Yata) is 6300 damage. Although you might be able to initally stop Stein by lowering their life points by 3000 (or more), they only need to lower yours by 1700 first to win with it. Add 1 equip card or another monster via special summon and that's most all the way to 8000.

Cyber-Stein is just as easy to use as Yata and most duelists I see know how to wait for the right time to use it, the same as with Yata. That's why I think it should be banned the same as Yata.

Is that a better argument everyone?


whats your point

oo no i lost to a combo deck 4 times meaning sumone probly built it right
BIG WHOOP iv lost to aggro decks aload of times yet i dont expect people to start banning aggro

ow and in what way is stein = yata
i mean we are talkin about that little bird who used to kill everyone right
u see the reason that got banned is because 8 out of 10 agressive decks abused him to hell

[guynamedjoe]

It is banned

[DarkHole]

I like how people make all these Stein threads then they ban him shortly after.

[xxxplizit]

You got your wish (from santa)

[D.D.T.]

You have your wish. Now we can move on. With Stein gone what else is there?

[Airknight]

UDE listen to moaner too much...

[topspin1617]

UDE listen to moaner too much...

But for once they were moaning for the right reason. Stein has deserved this ban for a long time now.

[D.D.T.]

But for once they were moaning for the right reason. Stein has deserved this ban for a long time now.

That is true to state. Stein was one of the top decks in Japan and has always been there until recently. This will stop people from saying that Konami and Upperdeck like Machines! Or will it?

[Airknight]

But for once they were moaning for the right reason. Stein has deserved this ban for a long time now.
thats opinion base really. there is alot of things they could have done instead of banning stein, such as un-restrict goat, un-restricted MST etc... IMO, un-restricting cards and introduce bigger card pool is always better than ban stuffs.

[topspin1617]

thats opinion base really. there is alot of things they could have done instead of banning stein, such as un-restrict goat, un-restricted MST etc... IMO, un-restricting cards and introduce bigger card pool is always better than ban stuffs.

True, but unlimiting Goat would do quite little to stop Stein (ever heard of Cyber End Dragon?) and unlimiting MST makes the Stein sacking easier, providing MORE ways to clear unwanted s/t to anyone who is intent on getting that cheap win.

[Airknight]

True, but unlimiting Goat would do quite little to stop Stein (ever heard of Cyber End Dragon?) and unlimiting MST makes the Stein sacking easier, providing MORE ways to clear unwanted s/t to anyone who is intent on getting that cheap win.
with goat, at least u would only take that 4000 damage and nth else. without goat, u probably would take cyber twin, stein + one more monster damage, which is game for sure.
with MST un-restricted, people would be likely to run threatening roar, waboku over those one for one removel, and people always moan about not have good enough reason to splash these cards in, with 2~3 MST running around, they would have a reason then. making stein harder to use.

[topspin1617]

with goat, at least u would only take that 4000 damage and nth else. without goat, u probably would take cyber twin, stein + one more monster damage, which is game for sure.
with MST un-restricted, people would be likely to run threatening roar, waboku over those one for one removel, and people always moan about not have good enough reason to splash these cards in, with 2~3 MST running around, they would have a reason then. making stein harder to use.

Yes... only 4000 with Scapegoat... you realize that's still half of your life in one shot.

Waboku and Threatening Roar make Stein harder to use, but you really have to consider how helpful they would be against a random Stein. You have to be lucky enough to get one before they can Stein you, and not have it MSTed at the end phase (because BOTH players have 3 MST), and if you do get it to go off, have some sort of answer for the Cyber End Dragon staring at you before it just wipes you out next turn.

[Airknight]

Yes... only 4000 with Scapegoat... you realize that's still half of your life in one shot.

Waboku and Threatening Roar make Stein harder to use, but you really have to consider how helpful they would be against a random Stein. You have to be lucky enough to get one before they can Stein you, and not have it MSTed at the end phase (because BOTH players have 3 MST), and if you do get it to go off, have some sort of answer for the Cyber End Dragon staring at you before it just wipes you out next turn.
sigh~~~ consider u win then.....

[xxxplizit]

with goat, at least u would only take that 4000 damage and nth else. without goat, u probably would take cyber twin, stein + one more monster damage, which is game for sure.
with MST un-restricted, people would be likely to run threatening roar, waboku over those one for one removel, and people always moan about not have good enough reason to splash these cards in, with 2~3 MST running around, they would have a reason then. making stein harder to use.

Limiter Removal anyone? A limitered CED on goat = win.

[Airknight]

Limiter Removal anyone? A limitered CED on goat = win.
limiter was not tech in as tech stein as i record :/

if u know u r playing a stein OTK and u still use goat, u deserve it then. otherwise, goat can most likely stop stein.